Comedian V Economist V Chaser

Adam: [00:02:04] Hello and welcome to the Chaser report versus comedian versus economist. I actually have no idea who's fighting who right now, but it is tremendously exciting to be working today with Charles from the Chaser report. Hi Charles, how are you going?

Charles Firth: [00:02:18] Hello. Very well. The people who are listening to the Chaser report, this is an episode of the Chaser report. Don't be confused by the fact that there are other people this is. Still, I'm not being held hostage is 

Adam: [00:02:30] what I'm saying. This is why we need to bolster the cybersecurity budget because we've managed to infiltrate the Chaser report. 

Charles Firth: [00:02:37] Yeah, that's right. And also for people who from trying to listen to the Committee Invest Economist podcast. That's right, I should explain that the Chaser report is an incredibly funny, amazingly erudite daily podcast that you can subscribe to and then you don't have to listen to these shitty people. Sorry, you mentioned these boring people. You can just get, you know, undiluted chaser. 

Adam: [00:03:05] You don't have to wait a whole week to be bored. You can be bored every day. 

Charles Firth: [00:03:09] Well, that's exactly perfect. 

Adam: [00:03:14] Not so. It is nice to be working with each other. This is yeah, I guess this is what we call a crossover episode crossing the river, maybe even jumping the shark. My name's Adam. I'm the host of the Comedian Versus Economist podcast from Equity Mates Media that I host with my little older brother and real life economist Thomas. 

Thomas: [00:03:31] Adam, how are we going? Hi, Charles, 

Charles Firth: [00:03:33] what's your role, Thomas? Your role is to be the boring one. Is that right? 

Thomas: [00:03:37] Yeah, I like to call it insight and analysis, but yeah, yeah.

Adam: [00:03:42] Boy, you nailed it Boring one. I try and make the boring interesting, which is incredibly difficult. But yeah, that's 

Charles Firth: [00:03:50] my role on the Twitter board is to be the eye candy, the eye candy. Yeah, yeah. I'd provide all the sort of beauty and handsomeness that fit our listeners. 

Adam: [00:04:01] Demand really shines through on a podcast. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Explains to sequin bikini of one to the recording. 

Charles Firth: [00:04:07] Yeah, yeah. Oh yeah, yeah. If only people could see. 

Adam: [00:04:10] Yeah, you look amazing. 

Charles Firth: [00:04:12] I'm Bryce by Suzanne today. I guess even up my dress by you say having worked out how to dress yourself.  

Adam: [00:04:22] So we look, we're joining forces today. We're going to revel in the glory that was the federal budget that happened last Tuesday to pick through lots to unpack from the federal budget. I'm keen to get both of your thoughts, but I wanted to start. I thought a nice way of kind of gently easing us into this mash up was with a little quiz that I've put together. I just wanted to say, really, whether you've been paying attention to the budget and I was going to call the quiz, have you been paying attention? But obviously that's taken. So I'm calling this quiz budget or budget. And the name came about because trying to prepare for this show, I thought I'd head online and get some up to date budget goss. So I headed over to budget dot com that I could write to the source of fan out. Of course, that's the car hire company and not the government's budget site, which is, of course, budget dot gov today. And what struck me, though, is some of the specials in the deals and promotions available on the Budget Rent-A-Car website sounded a lot like what was being offered in the federal budget. Oh. So what I want you guys to do is I'm just going to give you some terms, some phrases, some commentary and ask if you can tell whether they are from the federal budget or the budget car rental company. Do you think you're up for it? 

Charles Firth: [00:05:35] This is a great idea for a quiz. I just assumed when I heard Batman vs. budget, budget or budget is that you didn't have access to a thesaurus. But no, this is a much better idea. 

Adam: [00:05:49] Right? Well, here's a little practise one just to get this to test you out. All right. So the first phrase was this phrase in the federal budget coverage or from budget rent a car free SUV upgrade. 

Charles Firth: [00:06:01] Oh man, it's sort of who gets Danes and melatonin? 

Adam: [00:06:08] Why don't we position you names of your brothers? So if you like this, this is nuts. Your names are your mother's child. Not not. Make a buzzing sound with your tongue. 

Charles Firth: [00:06:18] Oh, so can I. Can I say I think I think it's a trick question. I reckon it's both. I reckon both budget and budget have been. 

Adam: [00:06:30] You really don't have any faith. I said we'd start with an easy one. Oh, it's just a practise question. Do you think I've looked straight into a trick question? Well, you'd be right. 

Charles Firth: [00:06:41] Oh yeah. 

Adam: [00:06:44] Free as you upgrade. I guess it's to the letter it was from the budget car website, but of course, with the fuel excise being cut in half, then potentially there is now room for, I think, a free SUV upgrade as a result of the budget. Now I can finally afford to put petrol in an SUV. So in that sense, possibly an SUV upgrade. That's how easy it is. I got three questions three proper questions Are you ready to go? Yep. OK. All right. Was this phrase in the federal budget coverage or the Budget Rent-A-Car website? It is practical and temporary.

Thomas: [00:07:18] Thomas Thomas, I'm going to I'm going to go the federal budget 

Adam: [00:07:23] on that federal budget. You would be correct. Oh, ding, ding ding. The federal budget is practical and temporary, of course, Frydenberg saying repeatedly that that the measures in the federal budget were practical and temporary, but it is actually on the budget Rent-A-Car side. Again, that's how they describe a single day higher of a Toyota Corolla hatchback. It is practical and temporary, [00:07:46][22.8]

Charles Firth: [00:07:48] and I love it. Such an admission, isn't it, that they're saying these are temporary things like we're being nice to you now, but we're not going to be nice to you. We're not going on. And and these are clearly terrible IEDs. Economically, the doing is a really bad idea. This is just a temporary thing to get us some votes. We're not actually signalling to the markets. No, no, no. We're not going to do this permanently.

Adam: [00:08:16] Is it almost like the government isn't planning on staying around very long to see it through? Is that they they know already that, you know what, we'll just put it in just to get us, get us over the line. We're probably not going to be here in six months. It'll be someone else's problem. So here's some cash. We're doing handouts, but only a little bit should cover probably this week's rent and then you'll be back to square one. 

Thomas: [00:08:37] I've heard people talk about it being a poison pill for labour that in six months, the fuel excise just reverts unless it's extended. So it's a tough it's going to be a tough call if petrol prices are still over $100 a barrel. 

Charles Firth: [00:08:49] But you got to remember, like labour are the ones who are playing five DGSE. They always stuff it up right late. So but you know you think they and probably they've tricked even the liberals into thinking that they're going to get in? Yeah, and all is put in the poison pill. I mean, guaranteed labour won't get in and then the libs have their own have to consume their own poison pill. This is brilliant work by Anthony Albanese. Like sort of master strategist. 

Adam: [00:09:22] Very good. All right. Next question. Next question was this prise in the federal budget coverage or Budget Rent-A-Car website a dirty bomb? 

Charles Firth: [00:09:30] Oh um, Charles. Wow. Um, I'm one of these people who just buzzes. Yeah, slowly surely, that's the Budget Rent-A-Car website. It's like, you know, we can and we now have you. Andi's also known as a dirty bomb. 

Adam: [00:09:58] Yeah, it was actually. It was actually a review of one of their campaigns. Oh, right. So it was a dirty bomb one. And that was the it was the federal budget, of course. Lease sales describing the end of the fuel excise after the election as a dirty bomb that was going to blow up in Labour's face. But as we just discussed, there is every chance that it'll blow up in their own face after after labour stuff it up. 

Charles Firth: [00:10:24] But also like it's it's just things he, you know, I think we can assume that given the trajectory of the war in Ukraine, we will be looking at a peaceful utopia in six months. So. Mean, I think, you know, petrol prices will be 20 cents a litre. But yeah, like we cut the excise means basically petrol will be free by then. 

Adam: [00:10:46] It's interesting, though, isn't it, that they announced the cut to the excise, but it seems like the fuel the fuel crisis is only like what, a month old if that? So I don't know. Do we want the we want the government to be to be cutting the excise even temporarily? 

Charles Firth: [00:11:01] Like, No, it's a terrible policy. Yeah, it's a terrible policy because $3 billion, yeah, you can spend you could spend that on 300000 $10000 subsidies for EVs. You could actually make everyone. You could basically get everyone to drive. And that's half the number of car sales in Australia per year. You could you could actually just drive down the price of EVs in six months time. Everyone could be driving around in this Tesla utopia. And instead, we're just going to pump more carbon into the atmosphere. 

Thomas: [00:11:35] And it is pretty clearly in the budget. There's nothing for EVs like it's there's nothing in for the environment, but it's nothing particular for EVs. And at the same time, you're making petrol. Fossil fuel cars more cost competitive by driving down the petrol prices. 

Adam: [00:11:50] It's like, yeah, I was going to try it in my petrol car and buy a navy, but not anymore. Now that filling up? Very good. All right. Final question for the budget or budget quiz was this phrase in the federal budget coverage or the Budget Rent-A-Car website? Inflation is a real problem. Thomas 

Thomas: [00:12:11] I'm going to go the obvious here, but that's definitely in the federal budget. 

Adam: [00:12:15] No Budget Rent-A-Car website this time. A review of a space saver tyre in the Nissan X-Trail people saying that just simply 

Charles Firth: [00:12:26] not enough to throw these quiz had real potential.

Adam: [00:12:36] So it was you're an economist, though everyone's talking about inflation. Is it here to stay and will we wages catch up as promised or will inflation come down? What's going on with inflation? 

Thomas: [00:12:46] Yeah, I mean, it's it's an interesting one in the sense that the budget typically like when you've got when you're worried about inflation, you try to rein things in a bit. You want to stop the economy economy running so hot. So you either like raise interest rates to slow things down a bit or you cut back on the fiscal levers, which is fiscal government spending. But we can't if you've gone the opposite way here. So there's a whole bunch of handouts for people, as you know, the what is it like 8.6 billion cost of living package. So a huge amount of money that's going to pump into the economy. That's at the time that we're worried about inflation. So it's hard to see that not sort of fuelling the very inflation that's trying to trying to combat. Yeah. So there's definitely nothing here in the budget that sort of really helps inflation other than it helps people at sort of the lower end of the income spectrum 

Adam: [00:13:35] and the promises that wages will catch up right is that,

Charles Firth: [00:13:38] yeah, that's the problem. That's I mean, that's that's the 

Thomas: [00:13:40] line that's making you look at. The forward estimates unemployment down to three point seventy five per cent. That's the lowest since the 70s. They've got inflation picking up into the ironically into the range where the RBA feels justified in hiking rates. But those estimates have typically been terrible that they've never hit those wages estimates. Wages have always underperformed on the on the forecasts. I think I'm sceptical still, but with an unemployment rate of three point seven, five per cent, you're going to have to have some wage pressure in the system, you'd think. I don't think I don't think there's anything here in the budget that deals with inflation at all other than sort of a bit of a sop to voters to try and help. Like just just I think and just because it's in the news right now, it's like I feel like the budget is really responding to two months worth of news. Petrol prices are rising. Inflation's up. Here's a package that's going to deals with that. But there's nothing there that sort of in the long run helps with with the inflation 

Adam: [00:14:31] story, Josh said it was a plan for the future. I guess he didn't stipulate how far into the future did he just say it's a plan for the future? The future could be next Tuesday. 

Charles Firth: [00:14:42] Well, you know, I've actually just come up with the way that you could plug the hole in the budget, which is just thinking about it. They didn't address the tax on photo opportunities and had they'd done that. So because we've had massive inflation in the number of photo ops done by prime ministers over the last three years, like we're now at, I don't know. Correct me if I'm wrong, Thomas, but I think it's something like 3.7 trillion photo ops per day or something. 

Adam: [00:15:13] That's 80 times I in the numbers 

Charles Firth: [00:15:15] that yeah, I mean, at 20 per cent excise on photo ops would bring in, by my calculations, around 45 trillion billion quadrillion dollars per day. And and that would that would dampen inflation, wouldn't it? 

Adam: [00:15:31] And will add the fuel excise is only going to is only going to add to the photo ops? Yeah, because it's going to make transport cheaper. So shipping politicians around to flood affected areas at war zones anyway. It's only going to increase. I think you're right. I've completely missed the trick. 

Charles Firth: [00:15:50] I've heard that Google Maps has a whole problem in Australia at the moment. Yeah, she's the apparently every time they put out one of the Google Maps cars. Scott Morrison, he's at the camera and right beside it, photographed by the cameras. The all all the photos of Google Maps. Does this Scott Morrison 

Adam: [00:16:09] need out in front of a series of houses as he's running? 

Charles Firth: [00:16:13] He does like go look at your house on Google Maps. I guarantee you Scott Morrison is in the full range of things as well. 

Adam: [00:16:22] I had him with his face, with his face blurred out because he didn't realise that Google Maps actually is four million photos of Scott Morrison outside people's houses. 

Charles Firth: [00:16:32] See, that's Larry Face because you know how whenever there's a national crisis, he goes missing for a few weeks? That's what he's doing. He's doing the Google Maps thing. 

Adam: [00:16:42] Very good that ends the quiz, was anyone keeping score? I think it was one or so well, although 

Charles Firth: [00:16:48] because of inflation, it's tool 

Adam: [00:16:50] tool. That's right. Yeah. 

Adam: [00:19:36] Charles, what did you you would have tuned in and consumed the entire budget, and I did what what caught your eye from the budget? 

Charles Firth: [00:19:46] Well, I mean, you know, I think for me, I thought it was a very realistic budget. I thought it was really good. I mean, it's obvious in an election year budget.

Adam: [00:19:57] It wasn't buying votes, though. Well, it was the budget that was just handing out big bundles of cash to voters. Oh no. 

Charles Firth: [00:20:03] Yeah, nothing to do with unrelated. Not going to that. There's always the promise of a fast train in the lead up to the election in this budget. They didn't do that. What they had was a fast train, which is very different. It's not going to be fast. It is going to be faster than the really slow change that at the moment. Right. And I thought that was that's a sort of upgrade because it's like going, Oh yeah, it's not going fast, but it's just going to be a little bit faster. I think that's I mean, correct me if I'm wrong, Thomas, but you don't normally see from a government something so sort of realistic in in the budget papers. Pragmatic? Yeah, exactly. Yeah. You know, so and then there 

Adam: [00:20:46] is definitely something people can get on board with as well. Hmm. Okay. Yeah. Yeah, I do there. That's that's why they pay me the big bucks. 

Charles Firth: [00:20:54] I also think it was really good news for the arts this time around. I thought they announced a 20 percent cut to the arts. Yes. Which people have been saying Oh, but they cut 20 percent from the arts last time. But let's say think smaller this time around because the arts budget was 20 per cent less. So actually proportionately even the cut 20 per cent in the arts, that's actually less than last time. Right? Yeah. And that means that, you know, in a few years time, a 20 percent cut to the arts will only be like $1. You know, so 

Adam: [00:21:27] I think that's sensible, too. I mean, throughout the pandemic, if there's one sector of the economy that's had a really good 

Charles Firth: [00:21:33] in the eye, I think, 

Adam: [00:21:35] you know, the and the amount of performances and live live shows that have been going on throughout lockdowns in in Melbourne, in all over the country, I think they've just thrived. So.

Charles Firth: [00:21:48] And what's the purpose of the arts anyway? The purpose of the arts is to help us process large traumatic events in our lives, you know, catharsis, that sort of thing. Yeah, but you don't want to do that after spending it exhausted. You just want to get on with it. Yeah, yeah. I think the work took flapping around the Benghazi, thinking about the eternal verities. Now we've got widgets to ship. 

Adam: [00:22:15] We can't because we've got supply chain 

Charles Firth: [00:22:17] bottlenecks, but a better look. But I think the budget was all about the B, and it was good to see that that was the first leak. You know, toe to toe story, not 20 per cent, 20 cents of Eubie. Hmm. I mean, that is steady, steady. 

Adam: [00:22:32] It's going to make a big difference. 

Charles Firth: [00:22:34] Oh yeah. I mean, I've already put my 20 cents savings into the stock market. Admittedly, the stock market crashed and I have 10 things. But, you know, like that's 10 cents over time that could become, I don't know, 15, 16, maybe even 20 cents. 

Adam: [00:22:49] I mean, here in South Australia, we get 10 cents a can refund. So now we're talking 30 cents 30, and that is pure play. 

Charles Firth: [00:22:57] I don't think it does. It apply to Candace? Does it apply to Candace or is it just be? 

Adam: [00:23:01] Oh, they probably some exclusion like that. In some conditions, it only applies if you're buying a pony. 

Charles Firth: [00:23:08] I think not only if you're doing a photo op with the Pet Week. Yes, statistically it's very likely.

Adam: [00:23:16] So the PM is getting 10 20 cents of B is a photo opportunity.

Charles Firth: [00:23:21] B That's the reason he did. He went, Oh, I'll save about $4 million. You shake 

Adam: [00:23:27] his hand, you get 20 cents off as well 

Charles Firth: [00:23:31] if you shake his hand. No, I think the rule is that he shakes your hand, 

Adam: [00:23:37] he shakes your arm, shakes your arm and then offers you a discounted B for allowing him to shake your 

Charles Firth: [00:23:44] arm. Then and then the final measure that I thought was really interesting in it. Yeah, I mean, it really does show Australia is growing up as a nation. The extra $9 billion that they say that again, spend on cybersecurity. Yes, it is huge. I mean, that is huge. That is great. The way this government has, you know, is so good at delivering technology. I'm really looking forward to what they come up with for these $9 billion like, you know,  

Adam: [00:24:16] Roll out some cyber. They worry about that.

Charles Firth: [00:24:18] I actually have a theory that it's it's to train all the bureaucrats in Canberra. How to get the are you a robot? Things right? The capture. It's easy to capture it. It's to help people get around the problem of, especially for people like Peter Dutton. They have no problem getting around. The capture 

Adam: [00:24:39] I use all the images of the PM standing in front of the house,

Charles Firth: [00:24:43] which which way up is the Occator standing photo of me there. 

Adam: [00:24:53] Thomas, what stood out for you from the from the budget? I feel like

Thomas: [00:24:57] I'm Candace pause for a second. I feel like I'm just going to have some really boring,

Adam: [00:25:01] absolute top level we expect from you. 

Charles Firth: [00:25:03] Change of pace 

Adam: [00:25:07] and never something a little boring stories. What caught your eye in the budget? Just boring shit. Going to do another quiz? 

Charles Firth: [00:25:17] Yeah, just to press them. You had to watch it. Did you watch the budget say that you never watched the budget, which makes you depressed for days? 

Thomas: [00:25:29] I just I just feel like what I'm offering at this point is sort of out of tone with the rest of the show. 

Charles Firth: [00:25:34] I want to hear the boring stuff. The judges report listeners a very used to boring but horrible. They're to tackle dumb night on and 

Thomas: [00:25:49] it's not an exciting budget. Overall, there's not a lot that's exciting there. We got there's 17 billion discretionary there, that sort of money that could have not gone into the economy, but it is has gone into the economy. You've got 8.6 billion with the cost of living package, so you got like a bit of a stimulatory boost. It's a little pump of the accelerator pedal on the economy, but it's at a time where it's not the case for pumping. The accelerator pedal isn't really there. You've got massive gains coming out of commodity prices, lower welfare payments because unemployment's down unemployment rates tilting towards three point seventy five percent, the lowest rate since the 70s. So you're pumping the accelerator into an economy that's already going pretty great. Yeah, retail retail spending is up 19 per cent on where it was pre-COVID, and you just going to give consumers and households a whole bunch of extra cash. So it's really hard looking at this budget to see the economic rationale for the measures that are in place. Having watched the few budgets isn't surprising. It's an election. It's an election year budget. All budgets have their eyes on the election and that's sort of what you've got to. And then on top of that, you look at the distribution of the infrastructure packages. It seems like it's pretty clearly kind of some form of pork barrelling. Only 21 of the 144 projects that have been announced have been endorsed by Infrastructure Australia, which is supposedly the body that ticks off and recommends these projects. And the other thing that really got me zero four federal ICAC's so the last election, Morrison promised we're going to get a federal ÉCHEC integrity commission that was delayed and delayed and delayed and then finally just didn't happen. And now it's just come out of the budget altogether. There's no funding for it at all. So the Morrison government seems to have just completely abandoned any commitment to a federal Aycock. 

Adam: [00:27:40] Well, I think we fixed it that it we cleared up all the corruptions going from the government, so we don't need it anymore. That's true. Carry on. 

Charles Firth: [00:27:46] Yeah. And it was they had to use that money to pay off all the people who were complaining that old corruption. 

Adam: [00:27:52] That's right. I'm curious to hear your thoughts on the deficit, though. So you say that we're pumping the accelerator, but it's pushing us further down into debt. Does it matter? 

Thomas: [00:28:01] Yeah, I mean, yes and no, it matters, but not in the way we used to used to think it matters or the way that we were used to be. The politicians used to tell us it matters. Politicians used to hang their hat on their ability to deliver a surplus. There was never a really great economic reason why a surplus was better than a deficit used to get this analogy that governments are like a household. And if a household's got too much debt, that's a bad thing. But the analogy breaks down because a household can't just print its own money. I know you've tried Adam, but but you're not actually allowed to do that, so the analogy just doesn't work. So in terms of economic theory, there's never been a great rationale for why a modest surplus is better than a modest deficit. And then COVID happened and the deficit blew right out. And then, you know, with this one, there's no, you know, Frydenberg hung is, you know, had that catchphrase a while ago back in black and back on track. There's no mention of anything like that now, and no one seems to care. No one, no one's really complaining that, you know, we're looking at a budget deficit of three and a half percent of GDP. That's still massive. 

Charles Firth: [00:29:04] You've got to realise that it doesn't matter until Labour gets elected and then it becomes the most important thing ever. Isn't that what's going on like? The difference is that it's a liberal government who's delivered a deficit, so therefore it's a good deficit. Yeah, that's right. And then when Labour gets in, suddenly 70 per cent of the media is owned by Murdoch. They don't like the Labour Party. Suddenly, it'll be the biggest crisis in the world. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, exactly. I mean, I think Labour's in real trouble from this deficit that 

Adam: [00:29:37] the libs also. Forecast the forecast, some pretty significant reductions to the deficit to over the next X number of years, five years or whatever it was. Yeah. So I guess they can also, you know, in six months time, if Labour gets in, they can say, Well, we're we're on track to reduce this deficit. We have a plan and you haven't done that yet. So you've you've bowls it up again. I mean, 

Charles Firth: [00:29:59] clearly, the way to get rid of the budget deficit is to keep the photo op. It's going. Yeah, even that. Maybe that's like it. He won't be prime minister, but he's still going to go around. And if I do pay off the debt, 

Adam: [00:30:19] I think the Montgomery needs to pay 

Charles Firth: [00:30:22] the bills because the one thing that just seems to me to be a glaring problem with all is the actual share between capital and labour has just gone totally screwy in the last really 20 years, like economically. And there seems to still be no plan beyond, oh well, we've got low unemployment to actually get the wage growth, getting it a proper level and and that solves so many problems. Like actually, if you had year on year, the proper increases in wages, then suddenly houses become more affordable for the next generation. Suddenly, you're changing the proportion of profit between labour and capital, which has to happen at some point anyway. But also suddenly, yeah, you're in a slightly higher inflation environment. But actually, that means that stuff like the debt problems disappear because suddenly you're inflating your way out of debt. [00:31:24][62.0]

Adam: [00:31:25] So how do we get wage growth? [00:31:26][1.1]

Charles Firth: [00:31:26] It's about power. The problem is we've got a we've got a labour force that's not allowed to strike anymore. I mean, it's got to the point where in New South Wales we hit a try. I mean, it's so absurd to an extent. It's like it's a joke. But the minister thought he could shut down, like lock out the train employees, and that would be a good strategy. And it's because, well, someone's got to go on strike in the workers. It's like, I mean, it was protected action. They were officially allowed to go on strike at that point. But it got to the point where strikes are so rare in Australia in the exercise of, you know, collective labour power is so rare and it's so prescribed by these rules that have been really written by bosses that that the actually more common thing is is that the boss goes on strike so dumb. It's the dumbest system in the universe. 

Adam: [00:32:26] Maybe we just need some of the some of the people in top levels of government to go on strike. 

Charles Firth: [00:32:31] Luckily, our Governor-General has been doing the way he's been on strike and not working for the last three and a half years somehow still managed to catch Covid love was there to be completely isolated from the rest of the world. 

Adam: [00:32:47] Very good. I reckon we might. We might leave it there. We might wrap up. Giles, it's been amazing working with you. Thank you so much for joining us. 

Charles Firth: [00:32:55] Yeah, I wish I could say the same. Yes, but try 

Adam: [00:32:58] harder next time.

Charles Firth: [00:33:01] All right.

Adam: [00:33:01] Look, if if you have liked like what you've heard, you can find cheesy report, of course, on all of your podcast stations, Spotify, Apple, wherever you get your podcasts. And if you'd like us comedian versus economist, we do episodes every Wednesday. You'll find them in the same place. It's really not hard if you've managed to to make it this far and you're listening to us, then you know how to find podcasts. So hopefully you've enjoyed the show. We've enjoyed making it. We will talk to you all again soon. Thanks, guys. Thank you. Thank you. Yep.