How AI can help you find your next investment property with Harry Bennetto l PropHero

Bryce: [00:00:16] Welcome back to another episode. It is Bryce here. I am solo today without my equity buddy Ren. We've both been gallivanting around Europe for the last few weeks, but today I am joined instead by Harry Bennetto from PropHero. Harry is the head of revenue at PropHero, an Australian investment advisor that helps you find, buy and manage the best investment properties using an online platform and proprietary AI algorithm. Now I really enjoyed this chat. If you're a regular listener, you'd know that Ren and I are both currently trying to buy our first home here in Sydney and of course finding it incredibly difficult with the current state of prices and supply of housing available at the moment. And over the last few months we've been exploring and chatting to more people who are involved in the property market from an investment point of view, because whilst owning the home and being an owner occupier is of course the dream, it's not necessarily the first way that you can get into the property market. There are other opportunities and that comes in the form of an investment property to then use that as a ladder into an owner occupier at some point down the track. So in today's episode, we chat with Harry about his thoughts on the market currently not only here in Sydney but right across Australia. He goes through some of the different elements property investors should think about. And then of course we talk a bit about what PropHero does and how their platform helps you find investment properties and really take the emotion out of it. So it was a great conversation. If you're interested in investing in property or if you're interested in getting your own home but still struggling, this might be one for you. A quick note to say that PropHero did sponsor this episode. A huge thank you to them. We do choose who we work with. We do genuinely believe in the brands that we work with and a massive thanks to our sponsors for supporting equity mates. We couldn't do it without them. So without further ado, let's get into the episode. All right. Well, Harry, welcome to Equity Mates. 

Harry: [00:02:10] Thanks for having me, Bryce. 

Bryce: [00:02:11] So Harry is the head of revenue at PropHero, an Australian investment advisor that helps you find, buy and manage the best investment properties using an online platform and proprietary algorithms. Now, just a reminder that while we are licensed, we are not aware of your financial circumstances. So any information on this show is for entertainment and education purposes only. Any advice is general, but we are going to be focusing on the hottest asset in Australia and that is property, but not from the point of view of the owner occupier. Harry, you and I both in our mid-thirties struggling to get into the property market here in Sydney, it's tough. 

Harry: [00:02:52] I think you've added a couple of years, I'm.

Bryce: [00:02:54] Sorry. 

Harry: [00:02:55] I'd say early thirties.

Bryce: [00:02:56] What did I say, mid thirties. 

Harry: [00:02:57] What we can say in a little bit. 

Bryce: [00:02:59] Yeah, I'm actually that's true. I'm not even in my mid-thirties yet either. Early thirties, but we are struggling to get into the Australian property market. The focus of today's interview is that, you know, there are opportunities for us to get into property outside of the owner occupier. If you want to take the investment approach and also outside of Sydney, there are opportunities and that is what PropHero is here to do. So we're going to jump into it today. So let's kick off with the state of the Australian property market. Can you help us understand some of the key things that are going on at the moment? We've heard at the start of the year that prices were going to plummet. I don't necessarily think that's happening. Mortgage Cliff's there's different cities going in different directions. Can you help us understand where we're currently at with Australian property?

Harry: [00:03:46] Yeah, sure thing. Right. So my take on it now, take Prop zero is that the market has been incredibly resilient and of course there has been a significant increase in interest rates over the past 18 months. However, it's still really much. It comes back down to the fact that it's a supply and demand driven market and lack of supply and high levels of demand have definitely buoyed the market and made it far more resilient than what a lot of economists would expect, even though rates have gone quite a lot higher than what a lot of economists were suggesting it would go to. 

Bryce: [00:04:21] It is fascinating. It's one of those asset classes, particularly in Australia, that I think continues to surprise people time and time again, where you're expecting people are saying, you know, ten, 25% drop in prices and that may have happened in parts and you're probably closer to it than I am. But you know, I'm looking for a property at the moment and certainly not saying that in, you know, parts of Sydney particularly. Is this the case across Australia, is it, you know, Sydney or is Sydney one of the areas that is more buoyant than others? What are you seeing around some of the other capital cities? 

Harry: [00:04:55] Across the country? It's pretty strong, definitely like we've had. We've had areas that we've been buying in for 18 months, almost two years that we've had to put pause on just because there's just too much demand in each of those markets. So essentially, like. This is going up faster than what we've seen in the previous 12 months. And that sort of just kicked into gear just in the last few months. 

Bryce: [00:05:19] And when you say put a pause on it, do you mean pause buying because prices are moving too quickly? 

Harry: [00:05:25] Yeah, Essentially where we've stopped buying in a handful of areas because the entry points are just too high based on the investment value that we saw in that area.

Bryce: [00:05:34] Wow. But is it ever going to go back down? 

Harry: [00:05:38] Well, we want to see. What we've been really lucky to say is that there has been significant rental growth over the last 18 months, much higher than the long term average. So that's made it a lot more attractive as an investor to invest in a market when it's increasing pretty steadily. But in terms of like picking the right areas, we've got to make sure that we're not too late. If we're buying in an area where the data is indicating that the price is on a fair value basis a little bit too high. We're always happy to pivot and look at a new area to start buying in. 

Bryce: [00:06:10] Well, we'll unpack what PropHero does in a moment, because you do have a 200 point checklist that you use to help determine what is a good investment property. But I think on the other side of that, you know, we do talk about prices and I saw Alan Collar on ABC last night put up one of his famous graphs that showed that I think we're at a historical low at the moment in Australia in terms of the availability of rental properties, and I imagine that feeds into your 200 point checklist. But other yields are there on investment properties at that moment, because whilst you know rents are going up and vacancy rates are incredibly low, prices are now so high as well that you are getting good yields at the moment.

Harry: [00:06:48] Yeah, the yields are remaining very strong across the country. Like if you look at Sydney and Melbourne, the being the largest two cities in the country, the rental return that you get is below 3% if you're buying a house for both, both cities, so on the average. But if you're going outside of the two largest capitals in the country, you're still seeing rental yields in 4% plus territory comfortably, which is pretty strong for a property rental yield growth. 

Bryce: [00:07:14] And then finally, on the state of the market, what's the your view or prop here, his view on the impact of the mortgage cliff? We've heard it a lot over the last few months that this period that we're in at the moment this quarter, in the next is when a lot of people are coming off their fixed rate onto the variable and in some instances seeing an increase in their repayments of more than 100%. What impact do you think that is going to have or is having on the market, if any? 

Harry: [00:07:40] Yeah, we definitely see that in the more expensive parts of the market, there is more mortgage stress and what there was over the last few years, I'd say, in terms of how that will impact the market. Like if you're in that position, you're facing a mortgage mortgage cliff, you've got a couple of options. You either move out of your place, you rent it out, hopefully, and cover some of the difference that you're going to be paying to the bank on a monthly basis or you go and sell, which is the absolute worst case scenario. If you're in those areas where the rental yields are significantly lower, say Sydney or Melbourne, we definitely say that there could be more mortgage stress and more pain in those areas. But if you're in those areas where the rent Toyota is significantly higher and you have that is like the safety net, we can say that we think it's going to be significantly less pain. 

Bryce: [00:08:26] So Harry, now I want to understand a little bit more about the different types of real estate investing strategies. We've spoken on the show before about the concept of rent vesting. But before we do that, there are some of the things that all types of property investors should focus on time in market due diligence, those sorts of things. So when a client comes to you, what are some of those things that as a property investor I should be thinking about? 

Harry: [00:08:52] Yeah, So it's always important to have a long term outlook when you're investing in property. And a lot of our clients are coming to us saying, Hey, I can't buy my own backyard, so what should I do? What can I do to really come up with a decent property strategy that's going to enable me to firstly get into the market, but then grow my wealth by doing it through property. And a lot of our clients, you know, they're going to be looking to diversify out of, say, shares or other forms of investment that they're more comfortable with. And I guess it's really about like breaking down what the commitment is, of course, where you're buying a property and it's going to be a substantial sum of money and usually involving debt, which is scary for some people. So ensuring that you're in a position where you firstly can afford it, but then also having a super long term outlook is really important in my view. 

Bryce: [00:09:41] What is long term in property for you? Like, what do you say is the time frame that a client of prop here should be really considering? 

Harry: [00:09:50] We're generally talking like seven years plus, we haven't had any client sell yet, so that's all very good in our previous two years being up and running. So happy to say that. But yeah, we're looking at seven years plus. 

Bryce: [00:10:01] Always nice, right? So you're not looking at the length of the mortgage, 30 years or anything like that. You're sort of saying over the next seven years we think you should be able to generate X returns. And do you look at it from a yield point of view? Also, capital growth, What how do you balance that when looking at it at over seven years? 

Harry: [00:10:19] Yeah. So a lot of our clients are in sort of thirties and forties and they definitely have an emphasis on building up their equity through capital growth. So combining that with firstly getting a great asset to start with, but then combining that with being in a position to buy again and again is really important. So in order to do that, it does need to have a combination of high capital growth but also high rental growth and a high rental yield to support repurchase.

Bryce: [00:10:44] And so what are some of the you know, I mean, the, as I said, process of buying a house at the moment and there's a level of due diligence that needs to go into actually the House itself. Can you talk us through what that looks like or what I should be thinking about and then maybe waiving the 200 point checklist as well that you guys go through? 

Harry: [00:11:02] Yes. So we're very fortunate where we've got we're a team in each of the areas that we're buying in across the country. And without going into too much specific on exactly where we're buying, we can talk about creative capital cities, of course, But I've got team members who will do a due diligence check, which starts with the private inspection on the property to ensure that it's in the condition that it's been advertised, whether it's an off market or on market, too often the material can be quite challenging to find exactly what condition it's in, and then also ensuring that it often is subject to a pest and building inspection is an absolute non-negotiable and just really adding a layer of protection there for the buyer. 

Bryce: [00:11:41] Yeah, right. And then in terms of the 200 point checklist, what are some of the big components in there that you guys look at? 

Harry: [00:11:48] Yeah. So we're looking at a number of sort of key pillars. We're starting with the macroeconomics of a range. And so what are the factors that are going to be contributing to job creation, like their major infrastructure projects? Is there a decent amount of industry split or is it reliant on one particular industry, say, like the mining sector, for instance, which can be quite cyclical? And then from there we want to make sure that we're targeting areas where there's not a lot of supply risk. So if you're buying in a suburb, for instance, that's surrounded by a lot of vacant land that can be redeveloped or repurposed, that can present a lot of supply risk and say you're looking to buy this property now. But then in a handful of years time, you may be looking to sell and there's 50 of the exact same property available that can present some challenges to the design sale process you're going to be getting. Then on top of that, we want to make sure it's in an area that's increasing in demand as an increase in gentrification. We're looking for areas where there's an increase in affluence that's happening at a greater rate than the state or territory average that we're buying in, and that's usually a strong indicated that the area is in high demand and it's going to have relatively low vacancy rates, which is so important. 

Bryce: [00:12:57] Yeah, well where does price come into it for you guys? Like at what point do you say like how do you determine like an actual valuation and at what point in the checklist does that become important? 

Harry: [00:13:08] Once we're getting serious on property, we're always looking for comparables in the market and look for ones that are either superior in line or inferior. Getting an understanding of what the property is going to rent out for as well. To understand what your holding return on investment is going to be. And then when it comes to deciding exactly what value we're generally provided, arranged by what the recent sales have been and of course we're super long term with our investing. So we're looking to buy it at a really decent entry point and of course, where possible, buy on the market. If we're securing, say, an off market opportunity, which does come up every now and then. But having a super long term outlook is so important. 

Bryce: [00:13:49] And so I notice that part of your 200 point checklist as well was around climate change, which I thought was fascinating. And it's something that I have thought about and we've discussed in the office is, you know, my view on long term is certainly more than seven years. I'm thinking, you know, in terms of stocks anyway, 30, 40, this is going to get me to the end of my life kind of investment. And so if you think about what the properties that will be in demand in that period of time will be and the impact that climate change will have over the next 40 plus years, it's really interesting to see that you factor that in. Can you talk us a bit through that a bit more for us? 

Harry: [00:14:26] Yeah, absolutely. So from a climate point of view, we're looking at what's happening right now. What we know is factually available, whether it comes to like flood or bushfire risk. And that's so important that every address when you're on the proper platform, if we're presenting a property to you, you can say that it's got a risk category based on flood and bushfire risk. Then when we're looking super long term where we're now talking more 30 years, when we're talking climate change rather than seven years, but we're looking for the percentage of risk based on each category of climate risk and how many properties are at risk. So say a percentage basis of over two or 3% for flooding, for instance, which would be considered like a medium flood risk? And we're looking for. Developments and potential changes that could affect that over the long term and using the most up to date climate data to do so.

Bryce: [00:15:17] It's fascinating. So if properties are in like high bushfire zones, in the thick shrubs in, I don't know, up in Blue Mountains or somewhere, do you, do you guys just like for you. Is that just let's not even go there or do you present it to the two potential investors? As we've identified, this is high risk. It's still on you guys to decide. 

Harry: [00:15:38] If we have. We've got three categories, one not being climate specific, but a flood risk and bushfire risk and then noise risk, whether it's from a rail. Or busy road or flight path. For instance, if one of those is categorised as high and low, then we won't present it to a client again. It comes back to the fact that it's purely from an investment point of view and if you're if you've got a medium risk for bushfire risk, for instance, buying in the Blue Mountains, then you may not be able to get insurance. And if you can get insurance, it might be three or four times more than if you were buying there. That wasn't subject to the same level of bushfire risk. So looking at it purely from an investment basis, increase your holding cost and it reduces your potential to sell it in the future as well. 

Bryce: [00:16:21] This is the point where I would like to ask you which parts of the markets are proper are looking at, but I imagine this is you are not going to tell us, but what are the general areas that you guys are operating in at the moment? Are you able to share that?

Harry: [00:16:35] We've had a lot of success buying in a couple of major capitals, including Adelaide and Brisbane, which is they've both been pretty hot for a period of time and we're always looking for areas that are presenting more early opportunities, I guess I'd call it. So if you constantly just keep buying in the same areas which a lot of buyers agents do, you're going to be presenting risk on pricing basis and return on investment. So just constantly assessing every suburb in the country is part of our model. So we're looking at 15,000 odd suburbs in the country and looking to pick up on where we see the most opportunity for our next investment. 

Bryce: [00:17:11] So for the equity rights community that are listening, the idea of sort of property investing is something that in my mind anyway, you do sort of post buying your first home and when you've then got surplus cash or if you're fortunate enough, you then go and buy an investment property. But that's obviously not the sort of customer base that I have here. I imagine you've mentioned off air that it's sort of thirties to forties and people that are looking to get into the market. So talk us through who your clients and and sort of what this platform is actually designed for. 

Harry: [00:17:45] So 50% of our clients are approximately buying their first place as an investment which is really exciting for them. And almost two thirds of our clients Sydney based shout out to all the Sydney listeners who are struggling away with the Sydney market. 

Bryce: [00:17:59] Yeah, that's interesting. 

Harry: [00:18:00] But then. 

Bryce: [00:18:01] And just to clarify there, they've bought places through you guys, obviously not in Sydney. 

Harry: [00:18:05] Not in Sydney, correct? Yes. So the other 50% of our buyers are buying second, third, fourth, fifth class properties. So we do help a lot of time poor professionals who are focussed on their careers and just don't have the time to go and diversify their property investments and use us to secure a high performing asset, which is what we do on a day to day basis. Yeah. 

Bryce: [00:18:26] Wow. Now when it comes to investing in real estate, there are different ways to approach it. It's not just that rent versus let's go buy and then I'm going to rent in the area that I want to live. There are different sort of forms of investing in property. So can you help define some of the main ones and then potentially their pros and cons? 

Harry: [00:18:45] Yeah, absolutely. So touching on the fact that like a lot of our clients are going to that buy hold strategy. We're buying 100% existing property, which means there's always going to be things that come up, such as maintenance or slight renovations in order to continue holding that property for the long term. So that's the one that we definitely favour and we always focus our clients on this.

Bryce: [00:19:05] And so does that mean like no renovations required or anything like that? It's just we found you a great property, let's just buy it. You know, there's going to be some maintenance costs, but over the long term. 

Harry: [00:19:15] Yeah, absolutely. So, you know, often you can, you can build it into the purchase price. If there is substantial renovation that's required in order for it to be lived in. But we tend to avoid those sort of properties. Okay. The second option, of course, rent vesting, which ties in quite closely with that buy hold strategy if you're doing it as an investment. But then second to that, we've also got the flipping and subdivision option, which, you know, it's more of a property development style of investment, which in the current market is becoming increasingly challenging just based on like the blow-out on timing for building projects, the lack of resources. Still post-COVID, surprisingly, whether it's, you know, getting raw materials or labour and then focusing on that more short term strategy, which is something that we tend to avoid.

Bryce: [00:20:06] Yeah, I mean, the idea of flipping a house is quite romantic. You know, you come in, you buy something. She added a new bedroom and some new cupboards in the kitchen and then sell it a few months later. Is that something that a lot of your clients who are coming to you for or looking to for advice? 

Harry: [00:20:24] Yeah, it's a small portion of our clients do come to us saying, I want to, I want to find a diamond in the rough, I guess we call it where they want to go and invest 20 or 30 K to get it up to scratch and find a bit of a discount on the purchase price. And often it opens up more opportunities because most investors want to just buy and not even think about the property. So if you're able to find one side a little bit rough around the edges and available at a discounted price, then yeah, that's definitely something that we can assist with. It's less common, but we do have it come up from time to time.

Bryce: [00:20:58] And of those strategies, so buy and hold, which is what you guys focus on rent vesting. Then there's that buy subdivide, which seems like a lot of work and then sell also or the buy flip. So how do we know what's sort of right for us?

Harry: [00:21:13] I think like if you're relatively early in your property investing career, we can call that. Yeah, I think if you just keep it simple, it really will pay off. Like if you're taking on a significant amount of debt to purchase the property, you want it to be paying you an income pretty quickly. So if you're going to go and subdivide and go to a project that could take you 2 to 3 years without without you ever saying like a return on investment, it just that's a lot more risky a strategy because you're going to be financing this on the side and incurring a lot of cost to hold that property. Whereas if you're more focussed on getting something that is rentable as it is and it's going to rent out, well, it's going to basically, you know, put you in a far better position to firstly not just hold that property and watch it increase in value over the long term, but then be able to, you know, recycle equity and purchase again and again. 

Bryce: [00:22:02] You know, we keep saying that property is expensive, but like, what is the sort of average price if you have one or like what type of properties are you actually suggesting to your clients? Because you know, if mid thirties and forties are getting in and buying two three, you're obviously not suggesting, you know, million dollar, $2 million places. So what, what is the price sort of entry points that you're looking at. 

Harry: [00:22:27] So the price range that we're targeting is between 300,000 and 750,000. So there's pretty much an opportunity for a very big chunk of the population. And a lot of our clients are coming to us being Sydney based or Melbourne based, for instance, where the their own backyard is extremely expensive, They might go and get pre-approval for 1.2 mil, have a look around and go, Hey, that doesn't sort of scratch the surface of what I'm trying to do. Yeah. And then they come to us and go, Look, I can buy one or two properties up to 1.2 mil. Where should we start? 

Bryce: [00:22:58] And then. And then you take them through the whole sales process. 

Harry: [00:23:01] Yeah, absolutely. So it's basically we're here to hold your hand from start to finish. We're using our data to unlock the best performing areas in the country. Also using our platform, you can track the performance of your property portfolio over the long term and also manage expenses on this platform as well. 

Bryce: [00:23:18] Well, you mentioned data there and we haven't really dug into it, so that's probably a good point. I said in the intro that you use air and it feels like a lot of people are using AI for all sorts of bits and pieces at the moment, but you've got a proprietary AI algorithm and an online platform. So how does that actually work? What what do you mean by an AI platform or an algorithm? Is it just sort of accumulating huge amounts of data and then suggesting where the investment should take place? 

Harry: [00:23:47] Yeah, 100%. So we're looking at 30 odd data variables and data sources. Sorry, say that again, 30 data sources and approximately 200 data variables. And really we're using it to break down the journey from where we're saying hey, by in the suburb price and really working backwards from that and saying, okay, these are the reasons why we're suggesting to buy in this particular area. This is why we think it's an excellent investment base, that this is the data from a numbers point of view and how it really stacks up as a great place to buy at the current entry point and hold for the long term. 

Bryce: [00:24:23] So it's an emotionless way of choosing property, really. 

Harry: [00:24:27] It's interesting you say that because it just doesn't seem like you can fully remove emotion from a property investment. 

Bryce: [00:24:34] So much money involved. 

Harry: [00:24:35] Yeah, there's so much money involved that people still get can get trapped in that idea of imagining themselves living in it, even if they never plan on living in, you know, Adelaide or Brisbane or wherever we're talking about. Yeah. And it is because there's that human element of people living in the property that you want to make sure it's functional and everything. So the, the way we're approaching it is to try and make it as focussed on being an investment as possible and removing the emotion. Yeah. 

Bryce: [00:25:02] And so what's to tell us a bit more about the company. It's two years old, but what, what like what's the, what's your differentiating factor. What. Why did it started?

Harry: [00:25:11] So one of our founders, Michael Roger, he's French and he's now lighting up our European operation, which I'll go into in just a moment. He had a really average experience using a buyer's agent for his owner's occupied place in Sydney. And through that just decided that, you know, firstly he ended up finding the property himself, presented it to the buyer's agent and they said yeah it was, it's that looks good, let's buy that. And then he got charged, you know, a significant commission which they just didn't see the value in it. So using his negative experience, creating an awesome company where we've now got 60 people globally, where we're buying properties in Australia, Spain and also Indonesia as well now.

Bryce: [00:25:54] Oh great. 

Harry: [00:25:55] Global footprint. 

Bryce: [00:25:56] Indo. 

Harry: [00:25:56] Yeah.

Bryce: [00:25:57] Nice buying up all the beachfront. Well where, where in Indo. 

Harry: [00:26:02] In Bali.

Bryce: [00:26:03] And Bali. Yeah. That's interesting. Can I come to you as an Australian and will you help me buy there or do you have to be local or like how does that work from, from a global point of view. 

Harry: [00:26:14] Yeah. So we're actually about to open it up for Australian buyers. So watch this space epic. But we have had a number of our Australian clients use prop euro to buy in Spain as well as it's an even lower entry point from an investment point of view. 

Bryce: [00:26:30] That's fascinating. So talk us through the journey of partnering with you. Do you have a case study of a client potentially that you could sort of paint the picture of the end to end process and maybe the result for for that person? 

Harry: [00:26:43] Yeah. So we've been around for two years now and a lot of our early investors have now been put in a position where they're using equity to go and buy a second property, which is really exciting. So we're firm believers in firstly buying the right asset at the right price, but using an example recently of an investor who purchased for approximately 600,000 in North Brisbane, okay? And within 12 months property depreciated by 100,000. Wow. Look, they were fortunate enough to benefit from being able to draw that equity out and use it to fund the second purchase, which they have just completed. And it actually settled in June this year. And again, buying another property around that similar price point whilst living in the eastern suburbs of Sydney. So not having any impact on their lifestyle whatsoever. Obviously getting that initial deposit saved is super important. Yeah, but it really just unlocks so much opportunity when you get that initial investment done really well and you know you're seeing double digit growth to fund the next investment. 

Bryce: [00:27:48] Many of them are positively geared.

Harry: [00:27:50] At the moment. If you're buying right now, you basically need a 20% deposit and about an 8% rental note for a positively geared investment. So right now, no, but if you rewind the clock a couple of years, anything was so look, it's just changing your outlook on what the investment purpose is. And it's like if you're investing for cash flow right now and you're going into debt, it doesn't really make sense. Yeah, but if you're investing with a core focus on growth and then trying to hold it as long as possible whilst you're earning a solid income, then it does make sense in my view. 

Bryce: [00:28:26] Have you had any clients who have bought with you guys and then use the equity then actually go and buy it own Occupy. 

Harry: [00:28:32] Yes. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So we've had to have some of our investors, you know, fund the deposit for the owner occupied place with a combination of equity in the property but then also cash saved. So yeah. 

Bryce: [00:28:46] I mean it's so, it's so confusing for me I think because you know, Harriet, my wife is we both want to have an owner occupy. We both want to have a house, as we all do. But as you say, it's just so expensive here that, you know, you're paying so much money for nothing, essentially. And I love this concept, and I think I've said it in episodes where we've spoken about investing in property. I love the idea of being able to do this. And and if you've saved a deposit, you don't have to spend a million bucks on a house going by the $300,000 house in an area that has all of the, you know, the good economic tailwinds and or macroeconomic tailwinds that you spoke about, it's going to deliver a good yield. But it is that emotional pull between the sensible investment approach or the I guess the emotion.

Harry: [00:29:38] And it's also yeah, like the time invested in it, I, I think I got my first pre-approval back in like 2016 and ended up buying in 2020 so far and I've always been keen on property and have been working in this space for a very long time. But it just shows you when you're looking for that owner occupied, it can, it can really be quite draining too. 

Bryce: [00:30:00] Heats Up your Weekends. 

Harry: [00:30:01] Yeah and you know it's been very eye opening to work in such a dynamic environment where people are just purely. Focussed on the outcome rather than that. 

Bryce: [00:30:11] Yeah. The emotion of it. Yeah. Yeah. So you mentioned buyer's agents and you know, they can be fruitful if, if they're good and in the right areas and they do come at a cost and in some instances that cost is certainly well worth it, you know, ten, ten grand plus. But if that means getting a property that's off market or whatever it may be, that, you know, it certainly can be worth it. So do you guys get access to property? And then secondly, how do you guys get paid? What's your face structure? 

Harry: [00:30:39] Yeah. So in recent months, we've been buying about 50% of our properties as off market deals. Again, they go on to the exact same due diligence process as if it wasn't on the market too. So it doesn't necessarily mean that they're a better property as such, but, you know, slightly more exclusive and easier to secure because you're not competing with the open market. And we are generating those opportunities from real estate connections that we've generated over the previous two years. And then when it comes to the cost of using pro up here, we've got an adjoining FE of 1490 dollars. Okay. And that gives you lifetime access to our property platform, which is where we have all the data and information for going about the property investment journey. Nice. And then we've actually just launched an equity match promo where it's prop your outcome so that you forward slash equity match. Okay. And that gives equity mates listeners a $1,000 discount on the success fee.

Bryce: [00:31:42] Nice. So it's 1490 to get lifetime access to the AI algorithm in the platform that is going to show you the properties that you guys are suggesting gives you the access to your portfolio. You can see how your properties are performing. Anything that's coming up on the horizon, I imagine. And then there's a settlement fee as well on any property that you help your investors secure. And if you had PropHero.com.au/equity mates, Harry and the team have a $1,000 discount on the services, which at the end of the day could be incredibly beneficial. If, if you're like me and you're sitting there, you have the ability to service a loan. It doesn't have to be a huge loan, but you have the ability to service the loan. You're struggling to get into property in your own backyard. This is an alternative way of getting access to the property market and then eventually getting that owner occupier, if that's if that's the long term drain. So check out prophero.com.au/equitymates for more information for the thousand dollar discount and also to get in contact with Harry and the team. But Harry, it's been awesome. Thank you so much. As I said, I, I really like platforms like this because any way that we can help young Australians get access to property through, you know, an investment point of view, as you said, some of the entry prices that you're looking at are in the three hundreds, which is far from what we're looking at here in some of the major capital cities. It makes it much more achievable and affordable. And if you're using, I guess, data sort of driven analysis to make the right decision, it takes that emotional side as best as possible away from it. So we do love to finish. We do love to have a bold prediction here at Equity Mate. So do you have any bold predictions to close it out for the Australian property market? 

Harry: [00:33:33] Yeah. Again, I want to highlight the fact that I think it's going to be very resilient, just focusing again on supply and demand, those two contributors to the market, look, who knows what interest rates are going to so no one's got a crystal ball. But yeah, I think any property investor who's in a position to do so would be open to looking at buying and having a long term strategy.

Bryce: [00:33:56] Mm. Love it. Well, Harry, thank you so much. Remember PropHero.com.au/equitymates for more information to grab that thousand dollar discount and Harry, it was great. Thank you very much. 

Harry: [00:34:07] Thanks, Bryce, great to catch up.