FIRE: Financial Independence (!) Retire Early (?) | Summer Series

Bryce: [00:00:29] Welcome back to Get Started Investing, where this summer we're taking a journey to financial freedom, supported by CommSec, the home of investing over six episodes. We'll be talking about the practical steps that you can take today to set yourself up for the ultimate goal: FIRE financial independence, retiring early. So if you're enjoying your summer break or dreading heading back to work, join us as we take the steps today to ensure that we can build the life we want into the future. My name is Bryce and for the final episode in this series, as always, I'm joined by my equity buddy, Ren. How are you going?

Alec: [00:01:00] I'm very good, Bryce. Very excited for this episode. In some of our previous episodes in this six part series, we mentioned that fire is a little bit controversial. I think everyone can agree with the first half of the acronym Financial Independence. Yeah. Where it gets controversial is the second half retire early. One thing that we saw on our Instagram is that if people are pursuing fire, they should find a job that they like, which, you know, I don't necessarily disagree with, but to each their own. And I think for a lot of people, the idea of retiring early is incredibly motivating. And if that's what gets you on the right path and making the right decisions. 

Bryce: [00:01:37] So be.

Alec: [00:01:37] It. Yeah. But this episode, we're really going to drill down on fire, the full acronym, and talk about what it means to us and also the different ways that it sort of, I guess, can manifest, like the different ways that you can sort of approach your money as you get closer and closer to that financial independence goal. 

Bryce: [00:01:59] Yes. I sense we have a bit of a fiery episode coming up. 

Alec: [00:02:03] Well, it's going to be from you, not from me. 

Bryce: [00:02:04] Absolutely. Look, I can't wait. Well, having the right support on your journey is important, which is why we're proud to partner with CommSec for this series. Investing in building wealth is a lifelong journey, as we've been discussing in this series, keep up to date with what impacts your investments through complex Investing Hub, you can get to grips with investing basics, learn about different global markets, or find information and research on stocks and ETFs. Get $0 brokerage for your first ten trades for Australian markets when you sign up. Visit CommSec.com.au for more. CommSec T&CS and other fees and charges apply. 

Alec: [00:02:38] Now, before we get started, a reminder that while we are licensed, we are not aware of your personal financial circumstances. Any information on this show is for education and entertainment purposes only. Any advice is general. 

Bryce: [00:02:48] All right. Ren, well with that said, it's our last episode. What are we going to be unpacking today? 

Alec: [00:02:53] All right. Bryce, well would you believe it? We are at the sixth and final episode of our 2024 Summer series, and the sixth and final step of our journey to financial independence. We are talking about what we do when we put it all together, and we achieve what we've set out to achieve. We've got FIRE, financial independence, retire early. That is the goal for so many people listening. And even if it's not about retiring early, the financial independence part, having the choice and being able to design the life you want is, is really, I think, what most people invest in. So what are we going to talk about in this episode? We're going to talk about why so many people want to achieve fire. And I guess how it can mean different things to different people. Most important question, how do you know when you're there? Let's say we've rolled up all the lessons from the first five episodes. We've built the habits, we're boosting our income, we're saving more, and we're investing it. How do we know when we've made it? Oh, that's only the second thing we're going to learn. We've got more to go. Then we're going to talk about the different ways to calculate your fire number. And then finally we're going to talk about what to do in different stages of life, i.e. just FIRE factor in children and school phase. 

Bryce: [00:04:06] Yeah. Can't wait for that bit because that's a question I always have for fire people. 

Alec: [00:04:11] Now we're not on this journey alone. There are thousands of people like you, like us listening to Get Started Investing and taking similar steps on the journey to financial independence. 

EM Community: [00:04:21] Hey equity mates. So, yeah, something I've implemented in my own financial life, people obviously developing better habits around saving and and having the ability to save as my income has grown and trying to have some discipline around that, but also things like, utilising financial instruments that are available in an intelligent way. So I've got a couple of, pretty generous credit cards that I get great value from. I try and purchase just about everything, on them, and I pay them off monthly so there's no interest and, reaped pretty significant rewards through the year in terms of frequent flyer points and other benefits and things that I can then leverage back into, you know, personal, rewards in terms of holidays and that kind of thing. So, that's been a big and very useful part of my own personal financial strategy. 

EM Community: [00:05:13] Hey, equity mate, one of the big things that have implemented kind of across my financial journey, that really makes me feel a whole lot better about my finances is, just having automated payments, for all of my bills. When I was younger, I didn't do that. I kind of trusted that I'd remember and I'd end up paying, you know, late fees and stuff like that. So, yeah, the automated payments, it's been a game changer for me. 

Alec: [00:05:40] So. Bryce, let's start with the biggest question. Why FIRE like why? Why is this something that so many people are chasing?

Bryce: [00:05:48] Fire essentially leads to the ability to live the way you want. That's how people chasing FIRE kind of communicate. They're like, I'm going to hit a level of financial independence where I don't need to rely on anyone to pay me, and I can live how I want.

Alec: [00:06:04] Yeah, look, I think it's all about people having choice. I think you can really feel quite constrained, I guess, and being forced to work a job that you may not want to work or, you know, not being able to live the life that you want to live. And as much as it sucks to say like money is an enabler, money, you know, money can't buy you happiness, but it can buy you choice. And often having choice might make you happier. So I think you know that the best way that you can set yourself up to have a choice is to make the right money decisions when you're young, you know, saving, investing, everything that we've spoken about. And some people want to retire early and, you know, lie on the beach when they're 40 and not work another day in their life. But I don't think that most people want to work a job that they like with people they enjoy being around for a cause that they're passionate about. And I think having choice allows you to do that. 

Bryce: [00:07:06] Absolutely.

Alec: [00:07:06] It allows you to tell a bad boss to get staffed. 

Bryce: [00:07:10] Well yeah. If you don't want to work there anymore. 

Alec: [00:07:12] Well yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah.

Bryce: [00:07:14] So, how do we know when we're there. And because as the name suggests fire financial independence retire early. You obviously need to, in its truest form, build enough wealth and assets so that you can retire. 

Alec: [00:07:31] Yeah. So the fire movement has a rule of 25. And basically what they say is calculate your annual expenses times it by 25. And that's your fire number. That's the number that you need to retire. Now that is just a new branding on an old rule, because the rule of 25 is just an inversion of a classic financial advisor and financial planning rule. The 4% rule. And the 4% rule basically says that you can safely withdraw an amount equal to 4% of your retirement savings, I think, adjusted for inflation, and you won't run out of money for 30 years. And so that's the rule of four or the 4% rule. So I guess before we get into it cause there's some things I want to unpack there, but like to just not jump into it too quickly. I guess if we're thinking about how those apply, if we want to figure out how much money we need to retire it. What's that? Annual expenses. You would probably actually know what yours is. Excluding mortgage. 

Bryce: [00:08:35] I don't know, off the top of my head. 

Alec: [00:08:36] Okay, let's call it 50 grand a year.

Bryce: [00:08:38] Call it that. Yeah. 

Alec: [00:08:39] And then your time's up by 25, and then that's your final number. So 1.25 mil. Simple. 

Bryce: [00:08:46] That's it. What I think the challenge there is is that it's a moment in time. And so to people then next year when my expenses go up go oh got to increase my FIRE number. Well 25 times. 

Alec: [00:08:59] Why would you why your expense is going up next to you though. 

Bryce: [00:09:02] Inflation like. Or I get a mortgage?

Alec: [00:09:07] No. Well, I think this is a key thing. Like your fire number has to factor in. Excluding inflation for now, it has to factor in everything. Like you can't calc. 

Bryce: [00:09:18] What I'm saying. Last year I didn't have a mortgage. My Fi number would have been X. Yeah. Just because I get a mortgage doesn't mean I don't want to watch a fire. 

Alec: [00:09:27] No, but I think you're maybe being a little bit deliberately. If if you know that you're going to get a mortgage that is part of your annual expenses, even if you don't have it this year, but you know you're going to get it.

Bryce: [00:09:39] Well, you're saying I have to anticipate my expenses for the next 30 years. 

Alec: [00:09:44] Yes. 

Bryce: [00:09:45] No, that's not that's not how people do it though. 

Alec: [00:09:47] It is bro. It's not like. It's not like they're like, I live at home with my parents, and I don't pay for food or rent, so I'm going to calculate my financial based on this year. They are like what is my life? What is the life I want to look like? What is that going to cost? And then that's the annual expenses number. 

Bryce: [00:10:08] Yeah. So you want to say what Bryce's Life going to look like in 30 years? That's ridiculous.

Alec: [00:10:16] Well, I think the thing is, as you 

Bryce: [00:10:18] Get. That's so wrong. Yeah. You get that so wrong. 

Alec: [00:10:21] You do. Yeah. And so like most, this is what retirement planning is though. It's like making your best approximation.

Bryce: [00:10:28] Yeah, sure. But your retirement planning is done at a little bit of a later stage in life than when most fire people are kicking around 18 year old saying they're on the journey to fire. 

Alec: [00:10:39] Yeah yeah, yeah. But I guess the thing is, like the 18 year old thinks, what's what my expenses are going to look like when I'm 50? And I might say, I'm going to need 60 grand in annual expenses. And therefore my fire number is 1.5 million. And then they'll start working towards that number, and they'll grow up and they'll change and they'll. But yeah, they'll have. Yeah, but the fire number can change as well. 

Bryce: [00:11:07] Yeah. No. Absolutely. Yeah. Yeah.

Alec: [00:11:09] Well I have an 18 year old saying I want to get to $1.5 million is a good place to start. 

Bryce: [00:11:15] I don't disagree with that. 

Alec: [00:11:16] Okay. You just sound like you're throwing a lot of shade. 

Bryce: [00:11:18] I do throw shade. Yeah, yeah.

Alec: [00:11:20] But we're not. But we're not locking that 18 year old into saying you told us 60 grand a year was how much you got to live off. Don't spend a penny more.

Bryce: [00:11:29] No, I know that. 

Alec: [00:11:30] Okay. Yeah. I'm glad you do. All right. Well, that's one gripe with this fire number calculator. Another one I have is just to be really careful around duration risk. So the 4% rule is the financial planning rule that says you won't run out of money over a 30 year period if you draw down 4% or less of your retirement savings. Key thing I said over a 30 year period. It's like, be classic. Retire at 65, die at 95. Sort of time frame thinking if you're chasing FIRE and you want to retire as early as possible. And, you know, we've spoken to people who are trying to retire in their late 30s and then, you know, trying to save 70% of their income and that ageing beans and rice all through their 30s because they want to get to their FIRE number by the time that 38, that 4% rule or you flip it around to make it a rule of 25 that's been tested on a 30 year period, whereas your money needs to last a lot more than 30 years. So the actual safe level of drawdown wouldn't be 4%. It might be like 2%, and that might last you 50 years. And therefore your rule of 25 should actually be a rule of 50. 

Bryce: [00:12:40] Yeah. 

Alec: [00:12:41] If that makes sense.

Bryce: [00:12:42] Yeah. Absolutely. Makes sense. Yeah. Which is why it's, I reckon it's a lot harder. It is a lot harder than you think. 

Alec: [00:12:48] Definitely. 

Bryce: [00:12:48] Get this number. The behaviour is the important part here. 

Alec: [00:12:52] Yeah. And we're going to talk about different stages of life as well kids and all of that. But I think the other challenge when you're calculating your fire number, your financial independence number, is it really assumes you've got housing sorted. I think in theory, you could have mortgage repayments as part of your cost, but, I mean, your FIRE number blows out like rough maths. Let's say you say $60,000 in annual expenses. That means your FIRE Number is 1.5 million. The average mortgage in Sydney is about five grand a month. And so that's 60 grand a year. So all of a sudden, your FIRE number doubles 120 grand times 25 3 million FIRE numbers like that becomes a lot less achievable. 

Bryce: [00:13:42] Well, it particularly if you're also paying the mortgage to get that. Like the key here is you want to be building you could. The key here is you want to be building assets that are going to liquid assets that you can draw down on and be paid. Yeah. If you're saying I my life when I'm 50 looks like this and this is how much I need. So I'm going to do this. If you then also assume between now and 50 you're going to buy a house and pay it off, like you're going to need serious amounts of free cash flow to build wealth outside of your house, to fund that lifestyle. 

Alec: [00:14:22] So I think with some clear caveats. So, calculating a FIRE number is a good approximation. It's a good starting point with the three key caveats. First one that you were talking about, Bryce said, it's really hard to predict your future expenses and what you're going to want and what you're going to need. Secondly, you've got to think about duration, that this rule is really being built off a 30 year retirement, and a lot of people are thinking about a lot longer than that. And then thirdly, thinking about housing. And this is really about having this FIRE number X your housing wealth. So it's not good enough to say I've got a $1.5 million house that is mortgage free. Well that's because it's not liquid. Yeah. So it's about having like the 1.5 million outside of the house that you paid off, which makes it a lot more daunting. Yeah. So with those clear caveats in mind, it's a pretty good approximation. What's your FIRE number?

Bryce: [00:15:19] I don't have a FIRE number, and I think it's dangerous. 

Alec: [00:15:22] Do you think it's dangerous? Yeah, for any more reasons. And we've just spoken about or

Bryce: [00:15:27] I just think that. I just think. I think you said it earlier in one of the episodes. It's just like building the habits of the Millionaire Next Door and just generally aiming for a financially secure stage of life he's going to get. He's going to get you there. I think having a number puts so much unnecessary pressure and mental pressure on you, it's like you, it will dictate then I believe it will dictate then how you actually enjoy your life between now and you hitting that number. Oh, I, you know, going on this holiday is going to I know people who do this going on my holiday is going to extend me by hitting my number by six months. And I don't and I don't want to do that. Or like, you know, this is coming out of my fire number and it is fine if that's how you want to live your life more than fine. But like, there's a lot of time between now. Yeah. And when you're 50. And so I think I don't want that stress like or sort of like an unnecessary burden and commitment to yourself that you're going to hit your number. And if you don't, you're not financially independent. Yeah. You'd probably hit financial independence well before then. So anyway, I'm not shitting on it, but I think, I think this whole series has been late, leading to like the journey to financial freedom. And it's not about the conclusion is not you need a number. The conclusion is the behaviour that we've spoken about throughout this and getting in early and just getting good habits.

Alec: [00:16:56] Yeah, yeah. Now I'm just thinking about if everything, every spending decision you thought about as a trade off in terms of length of time, you had to keep working like, oh, if I buy this car, that's going to be another two years of work. Like, if I yeah, if I, if I go to this wedding, this out of city wedding, it's going to be another six weeks of work and then you're. Yeah, at the weekend or the wedding or whatever. And all you're thinking about is like, is this worth an extra six weeks of work? Like, all of a sudden everything is an explicit trade off in your mind.

Bryce: [00:17:31] Oh, like, oh, damn it, we had a kid. My FIRE number extended. 

Alec: [00:17:37] 14 more years of work. 

Bryce: [00:17:38] My Fire number was extended. It's like, do you really want that? 

Alec: [00:17:41] Like, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Right. 

Bryce: [00:17:43] So, I can't remember what the question was. 

Alec: [00:17:47] It was do you have a phone number?

Bryce: [00:17:48] Oh yeah. So no. Yeah. No, but I have a, I have an, an ambition and an objective to get to the same outcome. If that makes sense. There's no, there's no there's no marker on the wall for me. I have a larger sort of things, which is I want to build, you know, the house and those sorts of things. So, do you? 

Alec: [00:18:11] Yeah, directionally. So, in the book we wrote about, Don't Stress Just Invest wherever good books are sold. We wrote about some of the numbers that the retirement organisations put up on the wall and say, this is the amount of money you need for a comfortable retirement if you're in Australia or if you're in America, if you're a single, if you're a couple, whatever. And for me, like I, the number in my mind is to get to a million, you're going to be in a good place. And then it's like, you know, some you know, we were speaking here about some people's phone number being 1.5 million know, maybe you need more or some retirement organisations think it's a lot less. But obviously it will grow as inflation grows and all of that. And like for me, there's so much uncertainty about how I will be living, you know, where I'll be living, all that stuff. And so I think, you know, a lot of your points around FIRE numbers being dangerous for that reason, like I agree with in principle. But for me, it's like I want to get to a million. 

Bryce: [00:19:17] Outside of Super?

Alec: [00:19:19] Sure. 

Bryce: [00:19:20] Well, I guess because. 

Alec: [00:19:21] I honestly don't really factor super in as an asset. 

Bryce: [00:19:24] The reason I say that is because, like, we are fortunate to have had super from day one when we're eligible, our parents not so like we will have that in our superannuation. 

Alec: [00:19:32] Every Australian. 

Bryce: [00:19:33] Hands down. 

Alec: [00:19:34] That works throughout their career. We'll have $1 million by the time we retire. So if people think I'm out of touch by saying a million, it's like, speak to me in 40 years. But yeah, I don't have a number that I'm desperately going towards. And I also don't have a like, I don't I, it's not for me a trigger point. It's not like getting the number. Tell my boss to fuck. Which would be tough because we work for ourselves and then, you know, go sit on a beach. It's like, that would be a nice number to have. 

Bryce: [00:20:07] Now, before we discuss the different ways of calculating your fire number, we want to say a massive thank you for CommSec for the support of this series. They are the home of investing. And they give you knowledge at your fingertips. Their educational content helps break down the things that can impact your money and investments. Get $0 brokerage on your first ten trades for Australian markets when you sign up, visit CommSec.com.au. CommSec, T&Cs, and other fees and charges apply. 

EM Community: [00:20:42] Hey, equity mates. The big one for me is that I grew up in the outer suburbs, and so much time and so much Money was Spent on commuting Public transport, petrol, parking, all that sort of stuff. But you save so much. You know, I ride my bike or I walk everywhere I need to go, basically. So that's, that's thousands of dollars a year in terms of parking and in terms of that sort of thing. Shopping habits as well. Like we got a cheaper by Miles, which is, it's a chain that sells products that are sort of near the use by date or excess stock at heavily Reduced prices that will go there first and then anything we can't get there, we'll go to a regular supermarket. 

EM Community: [00:21:17] Hey, Equity Mates. The big shift has been that when I was first out in the world, I just really wanted everything to be cheap and free, and it sort of had to be because my income was so low. But I would try and do everything myself the long way, rather than the way that made sense in terms of the rest of my wellbeing. And so now I think when I can afford it, if I can afford to pay someone for their expertise, I would much sooner do that. So if I need to fix my shower and I also have a million other priorities in the week, I would try and pay them to spend like six hours watching YouTube videos trying to learn. 

EM Community: [00:21:52] Hey equity mate. For me, not spending every week on disposables or things that I'll be throwing out with a year for trying to look for a long term quality and, you know, saving for them and big purchases. But rarely. 

Alec: [00:22:10] Welcome back to our Get Started Investing Summer Series. Over the past six episodes where you have been taking a journey to financial independence. And in this sixth and final episode, we've been talking about a lot of people's ultimate objective when it comes to financial independence, which is retiring early. That is the acronym for Financial Independence, Retire Early or FIRE, you might say. And we're talking about well, I mean, Bryce has told us why he thinks it's a dangerous movement before the break. So we're living dangerously in this episode. But, you know, like, we've spoken about how some people calculate what that number is, that financial independence number. And some of the caveats are around that, but I think what financial independence may be and what it looks like can be quite different for different people. And there are probably some sort of key buckets that the fire movement talks about. So I think the classic FIRE is just. 

Bryce: [00:23:11] Paints and rice.

Alec: [00:23:12] Well yeah, it's less about how you get there because I think that this whole series we've spoken about how you get there, it's more like what you do once you're there. And like the classic FIRE is you quit your job and you you're retired. You do what retirees do. You sit on a beach, you drive around in the caravan. What else do retirees do? Golf. 

Bryce: [00:23:31] Balls. 

Alec: [00:23:33] That's actually sounds really nice drink. So that's that's a classic FIRE. I think another fire that maybe will resonate with people a bit more is labelled barista fire.

Bryce: [00:23:45] Okay. What's barista fire? 

Alec: [00:23:48] So it's for people who want to like, save more and build up that financial independence so that they can work less in later life. The goal isn't to completely retire at an early age. You know, people want to work at less demanding jobs, perhaps part time jobs. Whoever labelled Barista Fire, I don't think has done a lot of work in cafes. Because I can say as someone who's done who did hospitality when they're at uni, it's it's certainly not less demanding or the stress free, relaxing job that this person might think, but, you know, this is, you know, if people want to work in the not for profit sector, you know, just jobs that maybe don't pay as much but want to support the lifestyle that they, they want. Yeah, they pursue this form of, you know, call it barista fire where they work really hard and they build good money habits and they build a nest egg. So then I can draw that down slowly while still working a job that pays less or that working a job, but they don't work full time. Yeah.

Bryce: [00:24:50] Barista fire. Nice. The next one is Coast Fire, and this is where you have enough invested or saved that even without additional contributions, your portfolio will grow to support you in retirement. And then these people typically still work, but really only to cover their current living expenses and then use their savings to coast into retirement. 

Alec: [00:25:12] And so if you think about that, like once you, you know, when, when we're working, we're putting money away every pay cheque into our investment account. But once we start putting money away, in theory, well, over the long term it'll still grow, like 8% a year. And so if you fire numbers 1.5 million, if you get to sort of 1.2. 

Bryce: [00:25:34] Grow into it.

Alec: [00:25:34] All of a sudden, you can just. Yeah. Coast. Yeah, you can get that compounding effect. And then all of a sudden, all that extra money, all the extra hours you were working to put money away as investing in this all of a sudden, your free time. 

Bryce: [00:25:47] Yeah. 

Alec: [00:25:48] Gulf. 

Bryce: [00:25:49] Gulf coast fire. How good.

Alec: [00:25:51] Yeah.

Bryce: [00:25:51] And then the final one Ren, fat fire. This is where you want to ensure that you can afford the finer things in retirement. That fat fire might be for you if.

Alec: [00:26:00] I think that fire is for you. 

Bryce: [00:26:03] I mean, sure, I'll take that. It involves earning as much as possible and saving as much as possible so that you don't have to live frugally in retirement. Who wants to live frugal in retirement? 

Alec: [00:26:13] Yeah, I didn't mean that as an insult. I just mean that you seem to rail against them. Yeah. 

Bryce: [00:26:18] No, this is my bucket. 

Alec: [00:26:19] Yeah. Yeah. Which is, which is somewhat an interesting personality trait because on one hand, you are, like, quite meticulous in, you know, like budgeting and cost controls. But then on the other hand, you really enjoy the finer things in life and don't like the idea of like, a beans and rice existence or anything. So it's like. 

Bryce: [00:26:38] Do you like the idea 

Alec: [00:26:40] No, but you wouldn't you wouldn't call the meticulous and particularly cost focussed. 

Bryce: [00:26:44] No, but I guess it's, they work together. 

Alec: [00:26:47] Yeah. I guess the way you square that circle is you control your costs where they can be controlled, so you can afford the finer things that you want to enjoy. 

Bryce: [00:26:57] Yeah. Or not. Yeah, exactly. Not have to live frugally. Yeah, yeah.

Alec: [00:27:00] Well, you know, you still do live frugally because you still make him take things out of the shopping basket. Not because you are going out shopping. 

Bryce: [00:27:07] Not true. Anyway. So those are the buckets for fire. Now it's important to consider life stages because as we said at the top of the show, if you are in the fire movement and you're chasing down a number, your life is going to change between that number arriving. And you're going to need to factor it in. Well, you should be factoring it in or trying to as you progress, have kids school phase like all of these things are going to take away from your ability to try and get to that number as fast as possible. So factoring those in, I don't know how you do it, is important. 

Alec: [00:27:42] Well, I think it's unfair to say that everyone who supports the fire movement just hasn't thought about our kids are expensive. Like they obviously know that that is a big cost and that's coming.

Bryce: [00:27:56] But how do you factor that? What would you put? 

Alec: [00:27:58] Well, I think for a lot of people, what it would be is like, the reason that I'm being so frugal before I have kids is because that's the time where you can really give yourself a head start, and then you can perhaps coast. You can massively sort of map it out on your fire calculator or whatever. You massively reduce the amount that you're investing, and saving and investing when you've got expenses like kids. But the foundation that you've built should hold you in good stead. 

Bryce: [00:28:28] Yeah. Just extend it. 

Alec: [00:28:29] Well, yeah, of course it will extend. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And, you know, like, I'm sure there are fire people that would make decisions around how many kids they want to have based on. 

Bryce: [00:28:38] Definitely. 

Alec: [00:28:39] Yeah. Yeah, yeah. But I mean, like when we were researching for this episode, when I was googling, like, fire with kids, there are a lot of fire blogs out there that are like, okay. 

Bryce: [00:28:52] How to do it with kids. 

Alec: [00:28:53] Doing it with kids. And like, they are very big advocates for, you know, like we're teaching our kids good money habits and stuff like that. Yeah. Maybe quite similar to your upbringing. 

Bryce: [00:29:05] Maybe potentially. I mean. 

Alec: [00:29:05] Maybe they're sending their kids out to sell pebbles on the street, but rather than the kid pocketing that money, they put that in an investment account.

Bryce: [00:29:13] Yes. Well, I mean, look, at the end of the day, it all boils down to the same thing, which is fundamentally the habits that this drives so good. 

Alec: [00:29:21] So I've just realised that the Pebble story was in the last episode. So if people have just joined us for this episode, that will make no sense. 

Bryce: [00:29:28] Go back to episode five and have a listen.

Alec: [00:29:31] But sorry, you're right. The habits. 

Bryce: [00:29:33] Yes, it's the habits here. It's whatever number you have or if you don't have a number or you're just loosely aiming to get to a point where you feel like you can financially rely on your own assets rather than a paycheque from your job. Like the whole point of this series is about the journey to get there. 

Alec: [00:29:50] Yeah.

Bryce: [00:29:50] And and I think that's, you know, how we should probably close out this whole thing as a reminder that, you know, you don't have to bucket yourself into one of these fire buckets. You don't have to sit down and do the maths and find a number. If all you're trying to do now is find the brokerage platform or sort your budget out, or whatever it may be, those are the appropriate steps to take to get to a level of financial independence. 

Alec: [00:30:21] The journey to financial independence doesn't end in the same destination, but it all begins with the same few steps. Saving more than you're spending, taking those savings and putting them to work. Investing, giving yourself time, and we mean decades of time to continue putting money away and letting that investment grow. And that's about it. 

Bryce: [00:30:44] That's it. Nice and quiet.

Alec: [00:30:46] As I was saying it, I was trying to think, what else do I need to say here?

Bryce: [00:30:49] But that's it. That's it. That's it. Think about diversified options that we've spoken about. Low cost indexes. Apps that allow you to get in for low dollar amounts and, annual in

Alec: [00:31:06] And then as you, as you go on this journey to financial independence, the best thing you can do to accelerate that journey is in finding crazy, exotic investment opportunities. It's just finding ways to save more and then finding ways to put more of that into the market. Done. Next question. See you in 2025. Yeah. I think in terms of what you should invest in. Well, that's what we've got the rest of the year on this podcast to talk about. Now, Bryce, for the final time, as we wrap up this six part series and take the final steps on our journey to financial independence. We want to say a massive thanks to CommSec for supporting this series. Hopefully together we've shown a path to how you can tap into the world of investing and build wealth over the long term. CommSec provides all the support, information and resources you need to build your confidence and make the right money moves. Sign up today to get $0 brokerage on your first ten trades for Aussie markets, and invest with as little as $50 through the Commbank app. Visit commbank.com.au for more. CommSec T&Cs and other fees and charges apply. 

Bryce: [00:32:15] Well, that brings us to the end of our six part journey to financial freedom. It's been an awesome series. Next week we will be back with regular programming as we answer the most common money and investing questions. If you have a question for us, send it through to ask at Equity Macomb and we'll make sure it gets on the list. Thanks for the support as always. We'll be back next week.