Understanding Interest Rates and Their Impact on Your Finances

Bryce: [00:00:31] Welcome to get started investing in this podcast. We cover all the basics that you need to start your investing journey. Are you joining us for the very first time? Is this the very start of your investing journey? Well, before you dive into this episode with us, our effort is designed to go from the very beginning, so we strongly recommend that you scroll up and start at episode one. Here at GSI, we unpack all the jargon and the confusing bits. We hear your investing stories with the goal of making investing less intimidating. And of course, we want to have a great time along the way. My name is Bryce and as always, I'm joined by my equity buddy, Ren. How you going? 

Alec: [00:01:05] Oh, I'm very good, Bryce. Great to be here with you for another episode. Excited for a new format that we're going to give a try today. 

Bryce: [00:01:14] That's it. We're going to be taking some of the key news stories that have popped up in our news feeds over the last week or so, and then bringing it back to basics and unpacking what it actually means for us as investors. There's been plenty of things in the news around interest rates. You may have seen a latest update around Magellan and if you're a shareholder, some option plans and also headlines around Mike Cannon-Brookes and AGL. Now if none of those ring a bell, then you're about to find out what they all mean and then we'll close out as well. With some Coles and Woollies prices, they're going up. 

Alec: [00:01:49] But before that, a little bit of housekeeping and more. Just a reminder of all the shows in the Equity Mates network. We are really happy with the dive, our business podcast, our business news podcast. So not so specific about investing, just more generally about the world of business. One story well explained, but then also we have a number of other podcasts in the network. Canadian Economist You're in good company Equity Mates crypto curious talk money to me, make pay love wherever you are on your investing journey, whatever your interests. We probably have a podcast for you, so make sure you check out the full stable of Equity Mates shows because yeah, there's a lot of hosts doing a lot of great work across the network. 

Bryce: [00:02:34] That's it. So head to Equity Mates dot com and to find out more information on all those shows or just search them in your podcast player. Now Ren, let's turn to the first big story that at the time of recording this time last week, the Reserve Bank of Australia or the RBA, our central bank, they raised interest rates for the first time in 11 years. 

Alec: [00:02:56] Yeah.

Bryce: [00:02:56] From 0.1%, which was a record low to 0.35%. So an increase of 0.25% to use some jargon, you might hear someone say 25 basis points, but essentially a quarter of a per cent was what the RBA lifted rates. What does this actually mean for us?

Alec: [00:03:17] So what it means is for banks, borrowing money has got a little bit more expensive. How that will affect us is two ways directly and then one way indirectly. 

Bryce: [00:03:27] Nice. Well let's let's kick off with directly. The Reserve Bank comes out. We've been through increased interest rates. How am I going to directly be impacted by that decision? 

Alec: [00:03:38] So the first one and the one that a lot of the reporting, a lot of the Instagram posts are focussed on was mortgages. And so the Reserve Bank increases the cash rate from 0.1% to 0.35%, that 25 basis point difference. Then all the banks passed that 25 basis points difference onto their customers, their mortgage holders. So if I have a 5% interest rate, mortgage rate with any of the big four banks, they've all passed this interest rate rise on. So now my mortgage is 5.25% and that means I pay more to the bank every month. 

Bryce: [00:04:17] Your interest payments have gone up. So there's some examples here of what that might mean. So increases on the average mortgage here in Australia is about $88 per month on a $600,000 home loan. The impact is an increase of $74 per month and on a $1 million home loan, the 0.25% increase equates to a $130 increase in your payments per month. So rent, as you said, direct impact. We've seen all four major banks pass on the full increase from the RBA through to their mortgage holders. 

Alec: [00:04:57] Now if that has people wondering a house price is going to fall, it's a red hot maybe at this point when banks give you a mortgage, they always assess you on an interest rate higher than what they're giving you. So if they've given you a 3% interest rate, they probably probably stress tested you on like a 6% interest rate. So it's probably not going to cause housing chaos, but this is probably the first of many interest rate rises. So I think for most people, most listeners, I don't know. Durkin More listeners have a household, don't have a house. 

Bryce: [00:05:31] I think. Well, that's a really good question. We should poll. We should. A community. 

Alec: [00:05:35] Yeah. I'm going to say I'm going.

Bryce: [00:05:36] To say I. 

Alec: [00:05:36] Have I'm going to say don't. 

Bryce: [00:05:38] Okay. 

Alec: [00:05:39] Just maybe because neither of us have a house. Maybe the majority. Maybe not the majority of listeners. The increase in mortgage rates doesn't really affect us day to day. But this next effect, this next direct effect affects everyone. And that is your savings account. And we have a gripe with the big four banks. Well, one of the big four banks here, because in theory, when the Reserve Bank increases interest rates, the banks then pass that on to savers as well. Your savings account, which probably has a 0.1% interest rate at the moment, they increase that interest rate. They give you a little bit more for your savings. And Bryce, would you believe it? Not all four of the big banks have passed it on to their savers. All of them have passed it on to their mortgage holders. They're happy to charge mortgage borrowers more, but not all of them are giving a little bit back to the savers. In a world where they just reported record profits as well. 

Bryce: [00:06:38] Ren, I would believe that. There's no question that over the last, you know, five, you could even stretch it out to perhaps ten years. Money in the bank account hasn't been the best investment. Interest rates have been so low. I'm just looking at some of the term deposit rates here. And for those that are unaware of term deposit, that's where you essentially commit your savings to the bank for a period of time and they'll pay you interest on it. Six month term deposit rates here for ANZ, CBA, NAB and Westpac. The big four are all 0.15%. So you're barely making any money over that six month period.

Alec: [00:07:20] What does that mean? If I have $100 saved in one of those, how much my getting. 

Bryce: [00:07:25] So Ren the 0.15% is the annualised rate. So that 0.15% for $100 you're going to get $0.15. 

Alec: [00:07:37] 1% give you a dollar. Yeah. So 0.15% would give you 15, give you 50. But you're not even going to get $0.15 here because did you say it was first?

Bryce: [00:07:46] It's a six month term, so you're actually going to get half of that, which is seven and a half cents. 

Alec: [00:07:51] I wonder if they round up or they round. 

Bryce: [00:07:52] They're definitely down. 

Alec: [00:07:56] So, look. 

Bryce: [00:07:57] Anyway. 

Alec: [00:07:58] Savings rates are terrible. We're not breaking any news here. Now, three of the big four banks have passed this interest rate increase on to the savers. A maybe not for every account, but for the, you know, like the bonus. That is my saver. Can you guess which of the big four banks did not pass it on.

Bryce: [00:08:23] CBA. 

Alec: [00:08:24] Saving. 

Bryce: [00:08:25] Too big, you know nothing against. Yeah, the biggest. My guess would be the reason the three others have is to be get a bit more attention than CBA. But anyway, I'm not surprised. 

Alec: [00:08:37] Yeah, yeah. To be fair. So this is from the Sydney Morning Herald a couple of days ago. So by the time we released this episode in a week, I'm going to tip that CBA probably follows suit. There'll be a bit of pressure. So I think we'll say lift your game, CBA if you haven't already by the time this is released, that's it. 

Bryce: [00:08:54] So two direct effects of interest rate rises. If you have a mortgage, you're going to feel it and and see the impact there. And equally, depending on which bank you're at, you might see an impact on your savings account. But we as investors and here at Get Started Investing feed are more interested in what it means to us as investors. And the stock market and the stock market is where you will see some indirect impact of an interest rate rise.

Alec: [00:09:22] Yeah. And if you have an American ETF or you're invested in American stocks, you've really seen how tough it's been in the share market to start this year and it's starting to flow through to Australia. Australia hasn't been hit as bad. You know, miners have done quite well and the banks are doing alright because interest rates are rising. So we haven't had it as bad in the U.S. but we're all feeling it. We're all seeing a lot of red in our portfolio. So let's quickly explain the indirect impact that interest rates have on the stockmarket. 

Bryce: [00:09:52] Sure. So let's start with why we have seen an increase in interest rates, and that's because of the inflation rates that we're seeing at the moment. Very briefly, inflation is the rise in a basket of consumer goods and services that you and I, Irene, might go out and buy, if that's right, rising too quickly. The Reserve Bank of Australia lifts rates. That means, as you said at the Top End, that money gets more expensive to borrow. It then becomes harder for people to borrow money as well as businesses to borrow money. And because of this cost of borrowing, a lot of these growth stocks that rely on borrowing money to grow, they start to get. Impacted as a result of growth stocks falling, they start to look a lot less attractive compared to the big end of town. A lot more sorry, a lot more a lot more attractive compared to the big end of town. Then everyone starts kind of freaking out and rewriting the whole market. 

Alec: [00:10:47] Yeah, and that can be confusing because it's like, why does Spotify falling make Apple less attractive? And it's because, you know, why would you pay seven times revenue for Apple when you can pay one times revenue for Spotify? It's all about the the relative opportunity. You know, the price that everything is is priced out and what you can get for that. So all of a sudden, as interest rates rise, growth stocks fall, and then also bond yields start to go up. So investors are constantly playing a game of where can I put my money to get the best return? And right now, they're saying these stocks that have just done so well over the past few years aren't the best place to get my money, and I'm not willing to pay as much for them. So so that's what's happening and that's why interest rates have this flow on effect into the stock market. And we're all feeling the indirect effects. Yeah. 

Bryce: [00:11:45] Certainly feeling the indirect effects.

Alec: [00:11:48] But I think I think the important thing is and we've done a bunch of stuff on social media about this, it's very easy to panic, but this is not something you need to panic about. If you're young, you've got time on your side. Zoom out and look at some charts because the market has had this before and it will have it again. There will be the bear markets, there will be crashes, there will be all of that stuff. But looking back in history, those are the buying opportunities that people say they wish they'd invested in. I wish I had bought Google or Amazon in 2000 in the tech wreck. I wish I had bought stocks in 2008 during the GFC. Imagine if I bought in March 2020 at the COVID lows. We all lament missing out on that. So I think it's just important to keep that in mind because who knows what we'll think about 20, 22 in five, ten, 20 years? 

Bryce: [00:12:41] Yeah. Well, over on Equity Mates Investing podcast this week, we're having a bit of a look at some investor letters. And then to your point, they're one of the quotes in one of the letters that we'll talk about. They say all past declines look like opportunities and all future declines look like risks. It's one of the great ironies in investing. 

Alec: [00:13:02] Nice. 

Bryce: [00:13:02] Yeah. So let's move on. 

Alec: [00:13:04] Yeah, that's a good point to move on. We said this would be a quick episode. It's not going to be. Yeah, we decide it. So the next story we want to talk about is Magellan's options. And this might not be familiar for people that don't own shares in Magellan, but for people that do own shares in Magellan. A new mysterious line showed up in their brokerage account over the past few weeks with the ticker code MF Geo Mine currently trading at $0, but apparently it's worth 7.8 cents. And so Bryce MF Geo W2.

Bryce: [00:13:41] If you don't own Magellan shares, this may still apply to you at some point in the future. So certainly pay attention because what we're talking about here are the Magellan options and they have appeared in my account as well. I'm a shareholder of Magellan. What Magellan have done to all of their shareholders is giving you options to buy shares in Magellan at a particular price and at a particular point in time.

Alec: [00:14:06] Well, up to a particular point in time. So between now and 2024, if you have these options, you can buy shares in Magellan at a $35 share price. Yes. Now, that's important price. And a little bit confusing because Magellan is trading at $15 a share. 

Bryce: [00:14:24] It is trading at $15 a share. So the question is, what should we do? 

Alec: [00:14:29] Why? Like, I don't get it. Why are they giving me an option to buy something at 35 when it's at 15? Like what? Like I don't get it. 

Bryce: [00:14:39] Because that's obviously what Magellan believe their share price to be. 

Alec: [00:14:45] Well, yeah, I think so. It's to encourage us to be long term shareholders because we have these options until 2024. Yeah. And so if between now and 2024, Magellan goes on an absolute tear and in 2024 they're worth $70 a share, then you have these options to buy still at $35 a share at half the price to what it's trading at. Great. 

Bryce: [00:15:12] Great. But. 

Alec: [00:15:14] But that doesn't mean that exercising them today makes sense. 

Bryce: [00:15:19] No. If you were to exercise them today when the share price is, what, roughly $15, you're going to be underwater straightaway. And there's also no guarantee that between that. That it's going to get to that $35 mark like we've seen companies that have have done as well as Magellan and then and suffered a drawback like they haven't really struggled over a long period of time to get back to the to the share price that they were previously trading. So this is not a a guarantee that, you know, you buy them at 35 and you're going to be able to sell them for a profit at some point. 

Alec: [00:15:54] Yeah. So, look, we can't give financial advice and we don't want to tell everyone what to do with the money. But I think we can say it doesn't make financial sense to exercise an option with a $35 price when you can buy the underlying asset for less than half of that in the open market. Yeah. So what I am doing personally, this isn't what you need to do, but what I am doing is I'm just going to leave those options in my brokerage account. If I decide I want to buy more Magellan, I'm not going to touch those options. I'll just buy Magellan and those options will stay there and I'll watch what happens with Magellan share price and maybe in the next couple of years I'll decide to exercise those options. If it doesn't reach the $35 share price, then those options will expire. But that's okay. I didn't pay anything for them and I'm not losing anything by not exercising them. The reason that we're sort of stressing this is I saw a tweet that a number of investors have exercised this option already, which is unfortunate. 

Bryce: [00:16:59] Yeah, that is unfortunate. Question that I'm not sure we have an answer to. If I sell all of my Magellan shares between now and 2024, do I still have the options available to me? 

Alec: [00:17:10] Great question. I don't know. 

Bryce: [00:17:12] Pick it up with Magellan. Yeah, we'll ask them. But yeah, look, we obviously want to see Magellan get back to 35 plus. I certainly do. I'm very much underwater on them. But yeah, your point stands Ren. If you can buy them at 15 now, why buy it at 35? You've got until 2024 to make a decision. Yeah. All right. We've got two other big stories to have a look at, Mike Cannon-Brookes and his activities on AGL and also Coles and Woollies and the increase in lettuce that with the increase in the price of lettuce that we're seeing. But before we jump into that, let's take a quick break to hear from our sponsors. All right, Ren We've got two stories to close out the episode. The first is Mike Cannon-Brookes is at it again buying up shares in AGL. What's the story? Why does this matter? 

Alec: [00:18:01] So AGL is Australia's biggest electricity generator and retailer and also our biggest club in the middle. Mike Cannon-Brookes is a software billionaire, one of the first two Australian software billionaires with his co-founder Scott Farquhar. But he has an obsession with AGL. There's a whole other episode in a bunch of cool stuff Cannon-Brookes is doing around climate and electricity policy. Sun Cable if you want to Google it. Mike Cannon-Brookes Open invitation for the show. But the reason that we want to talk about this today is because the federal election is coming up. But the federal election isn't the only time when your voice can be heard and your vote counts. This might Cannon-Brookes and AGL story involves all of the AGL shareholders, which we're sure there are some in the Equity Mates community. 

Bryce: [00:18:51] So Cannon-Brookes has acquired an 11% stake in AGL and is now AGL's largest shareholder. Now the reason he's done this is because he wants to stop the demerger that he's going to happen. 

Alec: [00:19:06] Yeah, AGL are trying to split the renewable energy assets and their customer accounts. If you have an electricity account with AGL, they want to make that one business and then they want to make all their coal fired power stations into a separate business. 

Bryce: [00:19:20] Yeah. And Mike Cannon-Brookes believe that this is going to be detrimental to shareholder value and of course he also has ambitions to turn AGL into a a more sustainable energy company than it currently is. But why we're talking about this is because Mike Cannon-Brookes understands the power of a shareholder vote and the AGL board needs 75% of shareholders to vote in favour of this demerger. 

Alec: [00:19:51] For it to go through, for it to go through the 75% majority. Mike Cannon-Brookes has 11% as you said, so he needs another 14.1% to stop the board getting 75% to stop this demerger going through. So if you own AGL shares, your vote matters, you're you can have an impact on on this outcome. Yes. Now, the vote, I'm pretty sure is the 15th of June, but double check that. So it's coming up pretty quick. It's like a month away. Here's the complexity. If you own AGL through a chest sponsored broker, so the shares are held in your name, you'll get paperwork, you probably already get heaps of paperwork. I imagine AGL have already sent you paperwork about this, but you'll get paperwork and it will explain how you how you can vote and your vote matters because I think if you don't vote, they assume you're going with the board.

Bryce: [00:20:45] Yeah, I think so. I think. 

Alec: [00:20:45] That's right. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Now, if you have custodial shares, if you're with a broker that doesn't hold the shares, that holds the shares on your behalf, you'll need to contact your broker to vote. Your broker won't contact you and tell you that this vote are coming. And the reason for that is there's so many. I was about to say pointless votes that happen. They're not pointless. But it's like, you know, we want to re-elect this board member and, you know, we want to sign off on this pay packet. And it's like that that is all important, but perhaps not as important as the climate emergency that we're living through. So we had to look at some of the custodial brokers, and you basically just need to send them an email at least a week or two before the vote and tell them your account, how many shares you own and how you want to vote. So, super hero, we looked at their fake queue page. You need to contact them via their live chat or their email at least four days before the vote. If you need to contact them at least two weeks before the vote, so it will depend on your broker. Have a look at their fake page or just send them an email to their support function. But if you own AGL shares, however you own them, your vote is going to matter on this whether you want them to demerge or whether you want Cannon-Brookes to stop the demerger. I think this was a good story for us to remind everyone and remind ourselves that as a shareholder we're part owner in the company and as a part owner in the company, we have a say in how it's run. 

Bryce: [00:22:15] I think that's the key thing. When we talk about buying businesses as investors, we're not traders, hedges anything like that. We're buying businesses. And you as a shareholder, you get the opportunity to actually vote on the direction of the business. So don't take these lightly. As you said, when there are instances where you're voting for just a new board member or whatever it may be, but when the opportunity like this comes up, you can actually have your voice be heard. So keep an eye out for your paperwork or contact your brokers to be involved. Let's close out Ren Coles. Will these two companies close to our hearts, as is food? We all love food here and everyone is likely experiencing the increase in prices not only at Coles and Woollies but across the board. But we're seeing inflation in both, both the big retailers and by inflation. Food prices are rising. 

Alec: [00:23:07] This sort of ties back into our first point around interest rates because a reason why interest rates have risen and are going to keep rising is because we're seeing inflation come through in a meaningful way. So food prices rose 5.3% in the March quarter. So the first three months of this year, 5.3%. And the reason that we included this was because you and am were complaining about the price of lettuce in the office yesterday. So the share. Share. What are you saying?

Bryce: [00:23:37] I'm actually really saying it with my own eyes. 

Alec: [00:23:41] We all heard it in the office yesterday. 

Bryce: [00:23:43] Iceberg. Iceberg, lettuce, 550. Broccoli, $8 a kilo. 

Alec: [00:23:50] That's because you go to that soy. 

Bryce: [00:23:51] Milk, $0.10 a bottle or even cereals bang through the roof. Wait, we all know. Wait. Ukraine war really hurting weight. It's it's really starting to come through. And particularly in fruit and vegetables, particularly fruit and vegetables really saying and impacts. There's been some supply constraints on a lot of fruit and vegetable growers domestically and internationally. And we all know that the result of low supply and continued or higher demand results in prices going up. And that's what we're seeing at Coles and Woolworths.

Alec: [00:24:24] Yeah. So Rabobank had some numbers. Horticulture was the biggest contributor to this food price increase. Vegetables up 6.6%. So that was your lettuce. 

Bryce: [00:24:38] Lettuce, broccoli. 

Alec: [00:24:39] Yeah. Pumpkin and fruit up 4.9% year on year. Seafood. Dairy also contributing, but not as much. But yeah, food prices are going up. So I think. 

Bryce: [00:24:50] Asparagus, three bucks a steak, it's it's unbelievable.

Alec: [00:24:56] Did you did you ever say shallots? 

Bryce: [00:24:57] It's all happening. 

Alec: [00:24:59] A few years ago, there was. What's the really expensive wholefoods? Whole Foods. They had one stick of asparagus in, like, a water bottle. No, just say that. And it was like ten bucks and I got shredded. 

Bryce: [00:25:11] That's ridiculous. That's ridiculous. 

Alec: [00:25:14] So 5.3% was the food price increase in the March quarter. Coles and Woollies both reported their results and a particular number stood out for me, which was that neither of them reported prices up 5.3%. 

Bryce: [00:25:31] No, they did obviously report price inflation, but this is because so Coles have increased their prices by across the board 3.3%, so not quite the 5.3 and Woolworths 2.7%, so not quite as much as Coles, but of a competitive dynamic there.

Alec: [00:25:50] So given that they basically dominate the market for food, how come it was less and where was the more competition? So Coles up 3.3%, Woollies up 2.7%. But we've just said that across the board food prices are up 5.3%. Yeah. So how do we square those numbers? How do we.

Bryce: [00:26:10] Make the maths work? Well, essentially when they're absorbing the costs of these increases. So whilst yes, revenues are up for both companies, revenue up 3.6% for Coles and Woolworths, revenue up an astonishing 9.7%. Their profitability or margins are going to be squeezed and hurt. 

Alec: [00:26:30] Yeah. Now I think it might be a little bit generous to say that Coles and Woollies are observed absorbing the price increases. We both worked in retail and for anyone that works in retail and in particular works in suppliers of the big two retailers, I think maybe suppliers are being asked to absorb this cost increase more than Coles and Woollies. Yeah. Unlike it will eventually flow through I think is, is the point. But if you're an investor in Coles and Woollies, if you're an investor in companies that supply Coles and Woollies, these numbers suggest that margins are going to be squeezed. Yeah, yeah. 

Bryce: [00:27:09] So yeah, these are their businesses that in times of inflation they can raise their prices. So they're sort of I wouldn't say inflation resistant businesses, but if you're thinking about investing. 

Alec: [00:27:21] In their consumer staples. 

Bryce: [00:27:23] Yeah. 

Alec: [00:27:23] And so you're going to go to Coles abilities or Aldi, you're going to go to the supermarket regardless. Yeah, they're the last thing you give up food. 

Bryce: [00:27:30] Exactly. And so there are some businesses you stay away from in times of inflation, others that you can still consider in your portfolio. And these retail consumer staples are certainly on the side of being able to deal with inflation a lot better than other companies. 

Alec: [00:27:46] Yeah. And I think it's. Pleasing from a consumer point of view that these retailers push back against these inflation increases because there is a world where you have a duopoly in the supermarket game and they become lazy duopolies and they just pass on price increases because they're like, Where else are you going to shop? You know, if we're both doing it, you don't really have a choice. But you actually want to see these big companies really fight to keep prices low for consumers and really, you know, make suppliers work for price increases. From a consumer point of view, yeah. So they're not just passing it on and saying customers will pay what they need. Yeah, it's like we're going to work for the consumer. So you think of calls and releases and you think of what you think of them. Yeah, but I think that's actually pleasing to say I. 

Bryce: [00:28:35] Would anticipate next time they report, those in inflation numbers are probably going to be a little bit higher. But time will only tell. It's not all bad news though. Ren Bananas down 26% from a year ago and avocados. My favourite down 29%. Yeah. 

Alec: [00:28:49] Avocados were like a dollar at one stage. It was good. Yeah. 

Bryce: [00:28:53] Certainly not the season for avocados. I'm certain I'm an anti shepherd guy. Bring back the house any day. But anyway, Ren. 

Alec: [00:29:01] Well, a little bit of a fun supermarket factor to close the day. A lot of people probably know this, but number one, items sold in the supermarket. 

Bryce: [00:29:11] Bananas. Bananas quickly followed by a hot chicken's. 

Alec: [00:29:15] Yeah. When we started at Coles and Woollies, there was the famous hot chicken wars of 2016 when both were cutting down prices. Yeah, yeah, yeah. 

Bryce: [00:29:25] You guys got told.

Alec: [00:29:27] Coles had nailed their supply chain. So that was Heidi for the increase in demand. And they drove Woollies supply chain, it broke it. You run out of. 

Bryce: [00:29:35] Hot chicken and it was at a time when I was working in store as well as part of the grad programme. And like it was chaos in the deli. Chaos in the deli. We couldn't keep up. There were hot chickens flying out the door. Then there weren't enough when everyone wanted them at 6 p.m. and in the evening coming back from work, you guys really put the heat on. But yeah, glad to see that Woolworths still remains number one food retailer in the country on all metrics.

Alec: [00:30:02] Well, look, we've crossed 30 minutes, so I'm not going to bother arguing with that. I'll just get Sasha to cut it out in post. Oh, but I think hopefully we've helped explain a few of the news stories going around interest rates and how they affect us as consumers and investors, what these options are that are showing up in our in our brokerage accounts, and what options are more generally why you vote matters as a retail investor and how you can exercise it. And then just some supermarket chart, because that's where we used to work. 

Bryce: [00:30:34] That's it. Warren, great to chat as always. And if you have any feedback on the episode or if you would like to give us feedback in general on how get started investing is going, please send us an email at contact@equitymates.com. Otherwise Brent will pick it up next week and.

Alec: [00:30:49] Go listen to all those other shows. We spoke about this. There's some great stuff out there. 

Bryce: [00:30:52] Yes, thank you.