Expert: Rachel Cruze shares how she disagrees with her Dad, Dave Ramsey.

Bryce: [00:00:15] And welcome back to another episode where we're tracking our journey of investing and whether you're an absolute beginner or approaching Warren Buffett status. Our aim is to help break down your barriers from beginning to dividend. Now, if you're joining us for the very first time, a huge welcome, It is great to have you as part of the Equity Mates community. It is great that you are starting your investing journey. If you feel like you need to get up to speed, we do have another episode. We do you have another show, Ren is showing me stuff on Instagram. We do have another show called Get Started Investing, which will get you up to speed. Now, while we are licensed, we are not aware of your financial circumstances. So any information on this show is for education and entertainment purposes only. Any advice is general. But with that said, my name is Bryce and as always, I'm joined by my equity buddy Ren. 

Alec: [00:01:02] How are you? I'm very good, Bryce. I've put the phone down and I am fully focussed. I'm excited for this interview. This was a great one. Rachel Cruze joined us in the studio. Well, virtually in the studio all the way from Tennessee. Yeah, the daughter of Dave Ramsey. Now, people may be familiar with that name, but if they're not Dave Ramsey, one of the biggest money personalities in the world, has I think the third biggest radio show in the US. Not money radio show, just radio show. Massive. He Does 3 hours a day, five days a week. That's the kind of content production I want to get to. And Rachel has followed in his footsteps and has her own show, The Rachel Cruze Show co-hosts, The Dave Ramsey Show, and has written a number of bestselling books as well. So some serious money expertise joining us today. 

Bryce: [00:01:56] Yeah, but what I liked about it, you would think that being the daughter of Dave Ramsey, you'd have it all down pat. But I think, you know, throughout the interview, she was honest that she still has things that she's working on in her money journey. It was great to get an insight into how she thinks about money with her kids and her husband. Some of the budgeting hacks and also passive income tips to fight the cost of living crisis that we're going through at the moment. And then we dig into how she thinks about building wealth through investments like property and stocks as well. So, yeah, it's a great interview. Well Rachel. Welcome to Equity Mates. 

Rachel: [00:02:32] Thank you. Thanks for having me, you guys. I appreciate it. 

Bryce: [00:02:35] I'd love to know if you could take us through the story of your first investment. We always like to know from our guests if there was a story or if it was just plain and simple. Dollar cost into an ETF, whatever it is. But if you could share the story of your first investment. 

Rachel: [00:02:52] Yes. Okay. So my first investment, I'm going to give credit to my parents on that one. They opened up a mutual funds in each of our names that they just kind of put some money in and it was under like an up my like a in America, like the Universal Universal Transfer Minors Act. So under that act you can open on behalf of a child an investment. So they did that. Gosh, I don't know how old I was. I mean, they probably like 12 or 13. Nice. And I remember dad sitting down with us and like opening up the paperwork and showing us, like, this graph of like the stock market, you know, here in America and like all of that and starting to learn growing. I didn't I mean, at that age, I had no idea that I remember him saying things like, yeah, it was your you'll have your mutual fund, your mutual fund. And he kept saying that word of reminding us. And so once I graduated college, got married, that was kind of part of a gift of like, Hey, here's how to help you start off life. And they didn't put that much in. But you guys know, with investing and compound interest, it's such a great thing seeing it grow. So we never really cashed it out. We we use that money and continued to let it grow and put more money in. So we still have that same funds today, which is very nice. 

Alec: [00:04:05] It reminds me a lot of Bryce's money story here. We often joke about he's sort of the textbook example of how you should teach your kids about money. And I'm the opposite. I was a dumb 20 year old just throwing money in the stock market and losing it. And Bryce, similar to you, sat down with his parents and started investing at a very early age. You've actually written a number one New York Times best selling book, Smart Money Smart Kids, all about helping kids or teaching your kids the right money habits and about investing and stuff like that. How have you then gone about teaching your kids and like, what are some of the key things that Bryce and I don't have kids yet, but you know, we're in our thirties now. It's coming quickly. What should we be thinking about when we have kids and we want to teach them about money? 

Rachel: [00:04:52] Yes, You know, I think one of the basic things my parents did, which was so smart and it's something we're doing with our kids, is teaching them that money comes from work. Money doesn't disappear. It doesn't just like come from mom and dad with this magical card that we swipe or on our phones that we get to tap a button and just stuff appears. Money. You have to make money by working. So we teach them that, you know, just doing chores around the house and making them earn some money. And then, I mean, we say it a lot of like, hey, we're going we're going to work, you know? And thankfully, you know, I'm I think we all have a level of service and all of our work, if you can view in that standpoint. So I'm like, I get to go and help people, but also I make money so that we can put food on the table and live in this house. And I do remind them, I mean, if they if stuff breaks like it costs money and mom has to go to work and Dad has to go to work to make money to replace that, like it's become like a theme because I'm like, I want them to know, like, so ingrained that that's where money comes from. It comes from work. So it has been a big push of mine and my husband to connect work and money. So I just think that's really important for especially the younger generation. I just want them to know that that's where it comes from. And then once you earn money, you can give it, you can save it, you can spend it. So even having little jars in their room so they know the difference, you know, So it's really I mean, it's honestly basic stuff. It's nothing that's like really complicated, you know, the mutual fund stuff. That's great discussion. But you don't need a teacher, a four year old that like they're okay. They know your life can be okay without that right now. But what's fascinating to is we've just now run up against this. It's kind of become a problem. And so we had to put a stop to it because my girls, my two older girls, they're eight and five, so they're still little. But it was like every thing was like, okay, if I go upstairs and get dressed for school, do I get a dollar? And I was like no, and it's like, I mean, everything. They just want money. And then it was like, can we can we, can we get Amazon your phone, Mom? Can we hit the Amazon app? Can we go to Target? Can we go? And they just wanted to buy it. And it kind of was a thing that was building for about two years or I'm sorry, two months. And just last week we set them down and we're like, We're not buying you all anything. You can't spend your money. You can do nothing about acquiring stuff until August 1st, nothing. And so our deal with them is whatever they save to these three months, we're going to double, we'll match it, and then they can go buy some stuff. But it was like little materialistic. Children running around being like, I want I want I'll do this to make it. And I'm like, Oh, this is exhausting. So we so it ended up kind of backfiring a little bit. I felt it so almost to say the intention is all good. I still think it's great lessons, but sometimes you even need boundaries of all Ones to. Keep all this stuff out. A lot of them, they will just buy. 

Bryce: [00:07:32] Well, Rachel, you say that you're a natural spend through a lot of the content that you do, which I think is great. You know, it's not all about it's about being honest with yourself and then developing a money plan from there. So how have you gone about developing an effective money plan so far? And, you know, I'm pretty sure a lot of us sitting at home listening to this will think of ourselves as natural spenders. So what are some of the the ways that you developed a plan that suited your your spending? 

Rachel: [00:07:58] Yeah, I think having long term priorities is really big. So I just knew like there just as a spender, you know, you have to have a level of maturity to be like, okay, if I really do spend everything I make, I'm going to be broke. So we can't do that. And I would say on the other end, savers have to develop some maturity to say, okay, I can't just hoard and hold on 24 seven. I have to actually live and take a little bit of risk and enjoy, which takes some maturing on their end. Right. Because it both is a little bit of this like playing into the fear of what I'm not going to get if I go to these extremes of a complete spender or saver. So for a spender, I've just had to look ahead and say, okay, I know 60 year old Rachel is still going to be a spender. It's just part of my natural wiring and I want her to have a great life. So what are the things I need to do to set her up well in the future? And that's where investing comes into play, saving for retirement, all of that. And so that's been a big thing. And then my spending in the present, I just have some pretty hard lines, like I will never use debt, I won't go into debt for stuff I will save up and pay for stuff with cash, live within my means, and then within my budgets. My husband and I budget. We have line items for us, so I have a Rachel White item so I can still enjoy and spend in that line item with that amount of money that we've agreed on. So I still get to enjoy life and spend, but it's just not completely out of control. So that's where I think that middle ground has come for me and it's been really helpful because I'm like, Yeah, it's it's I know that I'm doing the smart thing, but I still you guys love investing, so you maybe feel different, but still, like when I invest, I'm like, it just feels like this black hole. Like I just like, put money in. I'm like, I just like, I'll never see it again, even though I know I will later down in life. But it is still hard. I've been doing it, you know, for 13 years and it still as a spender, you still kind of like home. And that can take a really great vacation That money away. 

Alec: [00:09:49] I think that's reassuring in some ways to hear that, though. You know, you you've grown up around money experts and you're a money expert yourself. And to hear that, you still have those, you know, psychological challenges and the cognitive biases that come with investing, it's reassuring to know that everyone goes through those challenges. And I think speaking of challenges, this year and last year have been particularly challenging for everyone around the world. You know, we're speaking on opposite sides of of the world, and we're both facing cost of living crisis inflation, you know, rising interest rates. The story is is pretty universal. And really, when it comes to a cost of living crisis, there are two ways broadly that you can deal with it, find ways to make more money or find ways to reduce your spending. And, you know, between your show, The Rachel Cruz Show and co-hosting your dad's show, the Dave Ramsey Show you've spoken to, I was going to say thousands, but it's probably millions of people at this point about this challenge are what are some of the things that you're hearing and what are some of the top tips that you have when it comes to this? 

Rachel: [00:10:57] Yeah, it's a great question. And again, so many people, they're facing it and it's like, oh, and so I think the hardest thing to realise is, you know, whether you read studies that wages aren't keeping up with inflation, you know, you can, you can pull all this data. But the reality is at the end of the day, you know, people are sitting in their homes and they're thinking, oh, my gosh, like it costs how much to buy groceries. Right now we don't have it. So that pain and that fear is so real. And I think one of the things is it's so uncomfortable. But there has to be a level of sacrifice, like there's a point with money that it is so emotional, but also it is so mathematical, like it doesn't math doesn't have feelings, right? So the numbers have to work for you. And even though it's hard and it's not fun, you have to make those work. So whether that is cutting back expenses and saying, man, the luxuries that we were able to afford right now, we can't hopefully in the future. And there's some indicators that it might start getting better. But right now we have to still make this math work. Math is an emotional we are emotional with it, but we have to make this work. And so it is it's always hard to go backwards, So it's always hard to have something and then to pull back. That's a natural been, I think everyone has. But at the end I always say like, what is that price, though? Is the price of having all the subscriptions going out to eat. When you want even a car that you can't, you know, the car payment is too much like having all this stuff. Is that worth your peace of mind? Because at the end of the day, I think if you remove it and actually gain peace and control and can sleep at night, that is a much higher quality of life than having just stuff around you. So even though it's hard to go backwards on your expenses, it's something that that everyone you really do have to look at and say, what are my needs versus want? So that's that part of the equation. And I would say to you on that to look to see, okay, what are just habits that we kind of think are needs because it's just what we do versus No, what do we what do we really need? Because we can get in rhythms in life and you just you know, whether it's picking up fast food on Tuesday nights because the kids have sports or whatever, the thing is that it's just becomes a habit question everything, because you will find some money, you really can. And then on the working side, you know, I think the the Internet has brought so much good and so much terribleness to the world. But in one way I'm like, you can make great money. You know, this is like one of the best times to start a side business or a side hustle in life. So whether it's actually physically going out and doing something or even just from your computer from home, you know, whether it's freelancing or doing what you can to earn some extra money, you know, doing that is helpful. But I would rather cut expenses then take on extra work because I think there's a point that you can just keep working more and more and more to keep funding a lifestyle, and they just kind of keep pacing versus saying, Hey, if we have to live within this, what are the sacrifices we can make there to kind of have some margin? And again, just for a period of time, hopefully this isn't forever, but it really is important to evaluate it because the end result is you winning with money long term and having peace. That's the biggest stuff that is so key. 

Bryce: [00:14:04] Are there any great examples you've seen recently of people being able to generate passive income online rent? And I had doing a challenge at the moment where we did the math. As you said, mass numbers don't lie. They don't have feelings. We've worked out that if you invest $100 a month for 40 years and you just take the market return, that'll generate a savings of $350,000. So we're challenging ourselves to generate an extra $100 a month, but we're battling with ideas. 

Alec: [00:14:36] You're battling with ideas.

Bryce: [00:14:38] Ideas on how to do it. So do you have any examples from people that you've been working with or speaking to on generating passive income? 

Rachel: [00:14:46] Yes. Oh, gosh. I mean, on the education side, people will pay a lot for things like tutoring. So you kind of have to have some maybe some specialities in this. But anything around tutoring, teaching a language to a broad, which is the great thing about the Internet, you can reach people that way. I find people that are great when it comes to like grammar and writing, editing papers and articles for businesses. And again, it's more of that freelance work. So I think that's where the power is. If you can be your own boss and be able to generate that income, I think that's great. But I would also say just as a jumpstart, honestly, selling stuff online, like we all have all so much crap in our house that we don't use and don't need and so that can't last forever. Obviously you'd run out of stuff eventually, but if you just kind of need like a jumpstart, just look and see like, okay, what are the clothes that I don't wear where second-hand stuff I can sell stuff to or furniture to like whatever it is, see what's around that you can sell because people, people will pay for it. 

Alec: [00:15:49] Yeah. One of our So Bryce and I are struggling with the challenge a little bit, but one of our team members here, Emme, has been killing it. She she rents her like her formal dresses and stuff online. And she was telling us she earned $600 last month doing it. 

Bryce: [00:16:10] I don't think I've got any. No one wants to rent my t shirts. 

Alec: [00:16:13] That's no, definitely not. So, Rachel. 

Rachel: [00:16:19] That's awesome. 

Alec: [00:16:20] But when we're thinking about money and, you know, saving for retirement, one thing we think is sometimes lacking from the conversation is what is doing enough? You know, where in our thirties when we're younger, what is doing enough now to get to the number you want? And then when you're thinking about your future, what is that retirement number, that golden number that will give you enough to live the life that you want as you're older? So when when we sort of think about that, what how much should we be doing today and then what should we be aiming for in the future? How do you think about that? And I guess do you have like a golden number that you're chasing? 

Rachel: [00:16:59] Yeah. So we kind of run this formula that we tell the majority of people doing the baby steps. Here are solutions that 15% of your income should go into retirement. So overall, that's that we have found for majority of the scope of ages like that that. Should be enough by the time you get to retirement, that 15% until you pay off your house, you do some other really big goals. And then once you're completely debt free, then you can you'll you'll have the income to throw more at retirement. But I love that you said that because I think it's true that retirement's more of a number, not always an age know people kind of think I got to get to the certain age that I'm going to retire. But some people get to that age and they don't have retirement savings, so they can't retire. They have to keep working. So that number, I think, is is a really important goal. Yeah, and I'll be honest, I'm kind of embarrassed to say I don't know if I have a specific number that I'm like, Oh yeah, we're shooting for that. I think starting early was really helpful. So we knew if we kind of just stay on our rhythm, we're going to be more than fine and it's going to be great. But yeah, we we have more of a number for like short term savings and that kind of stuff that like we want to hit this in order to do X, Y and Z. But retirement specifically, Yeah, we kind of just keep our that 15% going in. And so that's kind of what we're doing right now. I it's a good exercise. I'm like, Nan, we've talked about numbers in other areas of our financial life, but retirement itself, I just keep being like, yeah, it's just it's not going away that 15 years. 

Alec: [00:18:27] I mean, look I'm the same and I'm sure prices as well. I don't think any of us have a number that we put up on the wall and I'm not sure how big the fire movement, the financial independence retire early movement is in the US. But I look at the certainty that pay because I respect people who do fire a lot. You know, they're saving so much and they're cutting their expenses and that but they have a fire number that they're chasing. But for me, I think about the future. You know, we're living through inflation at the moment. I think about how much I'm going to change in the future. And I'm like, I, I have no idea how much I'm going to want to spend when I'm 60, how many kids I'll have if I have paid off a house. And so I think like that uncertainty is always the thing that that gets me. And I guess how do you think about that? Like when you're planning for such an uncertain future, how do you, um, how do you factor all that in? 

Rachel: [00:19:15] Yeah, it's a great question because yeah, even that movement, like you said, part of it so intriguing and impressive that you're like, Oh my gosh, we're doing all this so early and they're able to retire. But I think too that, that there's a mindset not with all of them, but some of them where it's like, I just don't want to work anymore. And I think there's a dignity to work and there's something about being able to put gifts into the world and what you have to say and what you have to offer. That can be a great thing. So seeing work is like the evil thing that it can be in that movement. You know, I kind of hate that sometimes they vilify work, even though some work is terrible and not fun and you work for a jerk, your boss and and you get out and do the thing that you're passionate about that you love. That's the goal. So when you have that, I think, like ending work isn't the goal in life. It's to have just a prosperous, enjoyable life. So how can I do that? And I think work can play into that for people. Story Maybe not everybody, but that's where a little bit sometimes when I hear them talk, I'm like, Oh, but work isn't the enemy. But they sometimes can make it feel like that, you know, certain certain ones I've heard. But yeah, but the uncertainty, yeah, I think that it's very real. And the hard thing is we don't have a crystal ball. So I think going back and looking at patterns and looking at data and doing what we can to see, okay, how, how has history repeated itself? And, you know, the truth is, you know, there's kind of a doomsday airs on one end that's like all the banks are going to collapse and money's not even going to be a currency anymore. And the dollar, you know, all this stuff. And I'm like, well, if that happens, we're all screwed. There's nothing nothing you plan for that is ever going to even be the plan that you're going to use. So like, at that point, there's like really no way to to plan for that because that's just the end of the world is like, feels like. But so I don't think we're at that extreme point. I think that the you know, if you're especially in America, I know there's some difference, you know, with Australia in America, but for me, I'm like, I just believe in our economy enough that I still have a a confidence to invest and to still be in the market because I just look at patterns and data and know and inflation, it goes up and down all the time. You know, throughout history. It was crazy here in the U.S. in the eighties, seventies and eighties when it kind of backed down, you know, And then, I mean, you you can watch patterns. So I'm like, I just don't think that this is going to be forever. And I don't think our worst days are ahead either. So maybe a little Pollyanna, but that's coming from data and just confidence in the market. 

Bryce: [00:21:32] Equity Mates We're going to take a very quick break. And on the other side of this, we ask Rachel, what is the one thing that she disagrees with her dad, Dave Ramsey, when it comes to money? 

Alec: [00:21:45] You're listening to Equity Mates Investing podcast and we're speaking to Rachel Cruz, the number one New York Times best selling author and the daughter of Dave Ramsey, the I guess, the number one money expert in the world, you'd say. You could say the odds are after you. Of course. Thank you. But we've spoken to Rachel about budgeting, money, habits, getting your personal finances right. And in the second half of this interview, we're turning to the investing and wealth building side of it and asking Rachel how she approaches it. 

Bryce: [00:22:19] So, Rachel, let's move to investing and sort of building wealth through through the markets or I guess through investing in assets. You mentioned that it still feels like a bit of a black hole to you. And so how would you define your approach to investing? 

Rachel: [00:22:34] My approach to investing, one of them is consistency. I will always be investing. I don't I don't see I don't see a day unless, again, something crazy extreme happens that none of us are really prepared for, happen, occurs. And that could be a different story. But even when the market's down, I mean, I think consistency is so key because even when you buy at the bottom, it's on sale. You're getting more for what you're paying. And when you when the market goes back up, you get all those returns, you get those gains as it goes up, you get to ride that ride. And so I think that's really important, as is the consistency. Also, I would say part of it is that I don't allow fear to be my financial advisor. A fear can cause people to freak out and make really stupid decisions with their money because they're thinking so short term, not long term. So yeah, those are two big philosophies that I have as a overall general approach. But then, you know, I have my husband and I, you know, investing in to the market, traditional type investing. We do, but also real estate. Real estate. I come from a family that loves real estate. My husband's in that line of work. And so we have one rental property right now, but we kind of do like to diversify. So we do have some goals even within that sector of saying, Hey, what if we, you know, did a little bit more when it comes to real estate in the future. So that's something we're thinking about. But then again, more long term and not necessary to generate passive income but more for long term equity and all that. So so yeah, there's different approaches to take, but I'm not a I'm definitely not a huge risk taker. I mean, I can do some aggressive type mutual funds, which I'm comfortable with, but like crypto, like all the new fad stuff, I might, I kind of sit on the sidelines and see how it plays out. Maybe One day. But I'm I'm just watching it.

Alec: [00:24:20] Yeah, I was I was going to ask about the some of the more exotic asset classes, shall we say, like crypto. Not, not part of your investment plan. 

Rachel: [00:24:30] No. I'll never say never, though. I'll never say never again. It's just, you know, I just when I put my hard earned money, I'm like, after I work hard and pay taxes and have money, I want to just put it in something that I know is pretty much a guarantee. So it sounds boring, but I'm like just some good growth stock mutual funds. 

Alec: [00:24:50] Yeah, yeah, yeah. So on that. So mutual funds offer in Australia, we call them listed investment companies or managed funds, but they're exactly the same concept. Do you, do you really stick to mutual funds or are you also investing in individual stocks as well? 

Rachel: [00:25:10] You know, I don't do a lot of individual stocks. You know, if it's a small percentage of someone's world net worth and they have this one company they love, you know, I think that's you know, it's fine. I don't I don't teach on that very often cause I just think there's a lot of risk in it and people that try to play the market, I think I think I do know studies have been done panning out. Do people come out better ahead doing that? And usually not. Usually you end up losing money in the day trading kind of thing. But again, if it's a small percentage of your world and that's what people want to do, I think that's I think that's fine if that's what they want to do. I don't I don't honestly, I just I the risk is just I'm like, I don't wanna put all my eggs in one basket. So again, the mutual fund is a lot of diversification, which I like. And I mean, it may sound lazy, but it's also just true. I just don't have time. You know, some people are on like these apps and they're sitting there, you know, and I'm like. I mean, that's like, your thing. Like, that's great. But I'm like, I have three little kids. I got a job, I got to get home, I'm doing dinner. Two kids are at grandmas tonight. Like, I'm like, my life is hectic. Anyway, so sitting on an app, jumping money around kind of stresses me out. And so the idea of just like parking money somewhere, knowing it's going to grow on average 12% over the course of 70 years, we've seen that's what feels good to me. 

Alec: [00:26:25] I think that was a really big learning for me because when I started investing, as I said, Bryce had the perfect money upbringing, maybe not so much. And, you know, I saved up my money when I was a university student, put it in an individual stock and managed to lose it all. And a big financial epiphany for me early days was that there are these, you know, ETFs and mutual funds out there that give you instant diversification. And I think for a lot of people listening and for a lot of people starting their investing journey, it's never been easier to get started. You know, apps like Robinhood in the U.S. and there's a number in Australia that are similar, have brought costs down and have made the world more accessible. But it's still such a confusing world. We have all the access, but but none of the knowledge in many cases when we're getting started.

Rachel: [00:27:09] It's a great. 

Alec: [00:27:09] Point. What are some of the steps? You know, if you could go back and speak to 20 year old Alec, what are some of the steps you think the most important steps when getting started? 

Rachel: [00:27:19] Gosh, I don't know why I feel so old school talking to you guys. I'm like, y'all are probably like on the cusp of all this stuff that it's happening technology wise. So honestly, it sounds old school, but is true. I love having an investment professional in my corner, someone that does this day in and day out, and finding someone that has the heart of a teacher, not the heart of a salesman. So again, someone that is willing to teach you because to your point, there's not a lot of knowledge. And so intimidation is such a big hurdle for people when it comes to their finances. And I find when you get these like little sectors of your money life, whether it's insurance or taxes or investing, it's like you get these very specific lanes and it can be really intimidating because people are using this lingo in these terms and you're like, Oh gosh, I don't really know. And so understanding where you're putting your money is so key. So having an actual person that you can talk to in your corner that again does this day in and day out, I mean, they know so much stuff about your overall financial plan I think is so helpful and it's so worth it. So I like having someone in my corner now. You know, in the US we have like Vanguard, you know, where you can put some money in it's index funds and that's great. And people, you know, can do that. But I would tell people and I do, I would sit down with someone and just say, hey, here's my overall financial picture, because even ours, we set with ours in January and there was even like stuff with taxes and our giving with non-profit stuff that you can put in a fund and take that growth, like you can do some stuff that you're like, Oh, I never would have probably known that so specific, but they know that stuff. So have someone on your team that's great. And again, that you trust, not someone that you're like, Oh, they feel kind of greasy if they do that because they're kind of greasy. And don't don't give them your money because you probably won't trust them. But having someone in your corner I think is really is really key. 

Bryce: [00:29:07] So, Rachel, investing is a obviously a lifelong journey. I don't think anyone ever perfects it. And I think the same probably applies to money journey as well. As we grow older and face new challenges in life, there's always new things to understand and and get better at when it comes to our money journey. So what? What do you think you still get wrong? Or what are you trying to work on when it comes to your money habits? At the moment. 

Rachel: [00:29:31] I think as a natural spender, I still contend like contentment is something that I continue to have to work on. I go through seasons of it that I feel pretty content and I'm good, and then I go through seasons where I'm discontent and I like start buying and emotional spending and that kind of thing. And it's never anything big and luxurious. But I'm like, Amazon has been like the worst thing for me because I'm like, Oh yeah, there's earrings that are $10 there, you know, some books. I you know, I can get that emotional high so quickly and it's so inexpensive. But still, it's, it's, it's so funny how money is such a reflection of us and what's going on. And so, you know, I think for me, you know, the big stuff we've gotten out of debt. My husband, I've been doing this for 13 years. So so with the big money principles, we're not perfect at it, but we've got them down. We do budget consistently and all of that. But I think it's more of the hearts posture for so many for so many people. I mean, everybody, including myself, that you really do have to check because it's out of that is how you handle your money and why you handle the money the way you do so. So I'd say it's still the biggest hurdle. I mean, honestly, it's still just buying stuff and telling myself. But I started having like add to cart days where I'm like, I'm bored or like add to cart now, so I'll just add it to cart. I won't buy it. And it's amazing when the dopamine goes down and you're like, okay, I know that you're off the high. You kind of feel like you bought something is you still kind of shopped and added stuff, but you didn't buy it. So that's helped me nice know. 

Alec: [00:31:01] I like too. It'd be great if Amazon could add like a 48 hour cooling off feature. You couldn't buy it now. Wouldn't wouldn't be good for the business.

Rachel: [00:31:11] Yeah, that's right. That's right. 

Bryce: [00:31:12] Be good for social responsibility, right. 

Alec: [00:31:14] So, Rachel, we're almost out of time, but we we did want to ask this question. Your dad has obviously been speaking about money for, what, 30 plus years now? He's one of the biggest experts in the world when it comes to money. Is there anything that you disagree with your dad on when it comes to money? 

Rachel: [00:31:36] Okay. So, I mean, again, probably the the big value stuff. No, I'm like I you know, I, I just see how debt harms people. I see when you don't have the money to invest, you're missing out on compound interest. I see. When you're not a giver, that there's just probably a void of joy that is only really found in giving and being generous. So, like all these big principles, you know. Yeah, I see. And understand. I, I do think the way he goes about stuff though, is different than me because he, he is so black and white. And like, he, he even has this phrase and I make fun of him for it because he's like change and he'll clap twice. And he's like, I mean, if you been doing stupid, just change, you know, like, it's sometimes hard to say, like and he uses the example all the time. Smoking is like, you bet those people that have smoke for 30 years and then they quit overnight because they changed from like no. And their money that they have to like, chew gum and get a pet. It's like it's like it's hard is hard. It's hard to change. So. So the way the way I have I again, where he's a little probably a little bit more black and white on stuff, I'm like, you know, it it is hard Life is really it is really hard. And it's not easy just to change because we are who we are. And so working on yourself and understanding again your motivations is such a part of this whole money thing. So. So it's it's in those little quirks here. And they are, he says of something like Now. 

Bryce: [00:33:01] I'm going to use that in the office. Love that. Well, Rachel, it's been an absolute pleasure. We thoroughly sort of thank you for for your time. We do have an ongoing sort of competition throughout the year called the Equity Mates Awards. And one of the components of those awards is expert of the year, and it is voted for by our community. And by appearing on the show, you are now automatically in the running for Equity Mates Expert of the year. 

Rachel: [00:33:35] Oh my God, Yes. Okay, that would be an honour. 

Bryce: [00:33:38] So at the end of the year, first international guest I think so for 2023. So at the end of the year they will all vote to help them get a little bit of an understanding and insight into you. Beyond what we've discussed about today, where would you put the beautiful glass trophy that we send you if you win? 

Rachel: [00:33:59] So in my closet, we built a house two years ago before or. No, no, it's been three years before Covid. We moved in November of 19, right before everything happened. So part of my dream was I do love I already said I love clothes, accessories and things. So in my closet I have this like these two shelves with a bench and these boots. I have my two pairs of very nice shoes. The only two nice, nice, nice shoes that I have those. And like a purse, I have some stuff kind of displayed. I would put it on that show. Love actually, on one of those shelves right there. 

Bryce: [00:34:26] You might expect a photo, of course. 

Rachel: [00:34:29] Of course, if I win. 

Bryce: [00:34:33] Well, Rachel, so I thank you so much. As I said, we appreciate your time. And I know a lot of people would have taken a lot of value out of that given what's going on with with the current environment and everyone sort of thinking about the right money habits to ensure that we do have a good foundation. We do appreciate you spending the time with us today. So thank you very much. 

Rachel: [00:34:52] Thank you, guys. So appreciate it. Thanks for having me on. 

Alec: [00:34:54] Thanks, Rachel.